Jump to content


Photo

Lana Del Rey Born to Die Billboard Chart Immortality


  • Please log in to reply
158 replies to this topic

#141 OFFLINE   graham4anything

graham4anything

    Advanced Member

  • Topic Starter
  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,494 posts
  • Fan Since:2005
  • Time Online: 18d 19h 33m 51s

Posted 25 April 2018 - 11:59 AM

Lana if you're reading this-

 

perhaps Lana should remove Cola from Born to Die/Paradise edition and add Serial Killer to a new re-mastered edition

 

and also one can add perhaps FJM & Lana doing Ride as a bonus.


  • Kitschesque and I Come In Peace like this

Lana is our modern day Edith Piaf. Totally unique. a mixture of Brian WIlson Roy Orbison, Leonard Cohen, Gram Parsons, Elton & Bernie. Born to Die/Paradise is comparable to Elton's Captain Fantastic. All the records need to be listened whole. Waiting for a box set vinyl of all 400 songs not on any lp


#142 OFFLINE   Lust

Lust

    I fall to peices

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,393 posts
  • Fan Since:2015
  • Time Online: 92d 13h 35m 14s

Posted 28 April 2018 - 07:20 PM

According to chart masters, BTD passed 10 million sales worldwide. Im posting this because I feel like most of us didn't know this. The success of this album is quite amazing and I feel it can achieve even more if it comes back to the charts


http://chartmasters....ty-analysis/16/


  • slang, butterflies, longtimeman and 7 others like this

                                                                                                                 ConcreteWellgroomedHoneybadger-small.gif


#143 OFFLINE   graham4anything

graham4anything

    Advanced Member

  • Topic Starter
  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,494 posts
  • Fan Since:2005
  • Time Online: 18d 19h 33m 51s

Posted 02 May 2018 - 04:35 PM

****************************************************

Billboard​ announced today major changes in how they are going to be charting both the Hot 100 and all other song charts

​and the album charts including the Billboard 200.

 

​This is really important, and a major change and will start in July, with more changes in 2018 Quarter 3 and 4 into 2019 1st quarter

​and it will be analalized after that

 

​Perhaps there should be a separate OP explaining how the charts are done, and made each week for quick reference.

 

​Major shake-up will be that paid streams and other ways will be much more important (perhaps as much as 3 to 1) than ad-based (free) Spotify and youtube, and for now, Video stories will not be part of the mix.

 

​****************************************************

​LINK AT BILLBOARD ©

 

​Billboard finalizes changes to how streams are counted for the Billboard Hot 100 singles chart & BIllboard 200 album charts weekly

 

https://www.billboar...0-billboard-200


  • slang and Lust like this

Lana is our modern day Edith Piaf. Totally unique. a mixture of Brian WIlson Roy Orbison, Leonard Cohen, Gram Parsons, Elton & Bernie. Born to Die/Paradise is comparable to Elton's Captain Fantastic. All the records need to be listened whole. Waiting for a box set vinyl of all 400 songs not on any lp


#144 OFFLINE   InnAMORamento

InnAMORamento

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 515 posts
  • LocationSerbia (Србија)
  • Fan Since:2012
  • Time Online: 12d 10h 3m 13s

Posted 02 May 2018 - 05:42 PM

Is that good or bad for Lana?

#145 OFFLINE   graham4anything

graham4anything

    Advanced Member

  • Topic Starter
  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,494 posts
  • Fan Since:2005
  • Time Online: 18d 19h 33m 51s

Posted 02 May 2018 - 06:44 PM

@​InnAmorAmento

 

​it is too early to tell one way or another, but it appears if the system that will be in place soon was in place when Lust for Life was released,

​itwould not have even been close, Lana would have been #1 with no sweat. (that is an educated opinion, as we won'tknow until it goes into effect.


Lana is our modern day Edith Piaf. Totally unique. a mixture of Brian WIlson Roy Orbison, Leonard Cohen, Gram Parsons, Elton & Bernie. Born to Die/Paradise is comparable to Elton's Captain Fantastic. All the records need to be listened whole. Waiting for a box set vinyl of all 400 songs not on any lp


#146 OFFLINE   graham4anything

graham4anything

    Advanced Member

  • Topic Starter
  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,494 posts
  • Fan Since:2005
  • Time Online: 18d 19h 33m 51s

Posted 05 May 2018 - 12:26 PM

this somewhat helps explain things on the new system Billboard will have starting in July 2018

 

http://m.hitsdailydo.../news&id=311689

 

(note- anything highlighted or in caps is from the writers of this article, the bible is how the industry refers to Billboard charts)- ©HITS)

WEIGHTS AND MEASURES

 

Biz-watchers wonder about the potential impact of the Bible’s decision to rejigger the weighting of streams for its charts. With ad-supported streams (3,750:1) slated to have 1/3 the value of subscription streams (1,250:1), the project totals for releases relying heavily on the free tiers will decline. YouTube views will continue to be factored into the Hot 100 but not the Top 200.

 

Ad-supported streams account for 23% of the combined Spotify-Apple total and 33% of all Spotify streams, while Spotify premium and Apple contribute 48% and 29% of combined streams, respectively. With the changes, paid-only services would see an increase; services with both paid and ad-supported tiers could see a net reduction in SEA if ad-supported streams exceeded 25% of their total.

 

It would appear that most releases will see a 5-10% spike in first-week numbers, as paid streams tend to predominate in the early weeks of release; this will boost everyone’s numbers. Both Apple and the rights holders believe the changes are a step in the right direction.


Lana is our modern day Edith Piaf. Totally unique. a mixture of Brian WIlson Roy Orbison, Leonard Cohen, Gram Parsons, Elton & Bernie. Born to Die/Paradise is comparable to Elton's Captain Fantastic. All the records need to be listened whole. Waiting for a box set vinyl of all 400 songs not on any lp


#147 OFFLINE   slang

slang

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 585 posts
  • Time Online: 53d 15h 46m 16s

Posted 06 May 2018 - 12:00 PM

this somewhat helps explain things on the new system Billboard will have starting in July 2018

 

http://m.hitsdailydo.../news&id=311689

 

(note- anything highlighted or in caps is from the writers of this article, the bible is how the industry refers to Billboard charts)- ©HITS)

WEIGHTS AND MEASURES

 

Biz-watchers wonder about the potential impact of the Bible’s decision to rejigger the weighting of streams for its charts. With ad-supported streams (3,750:1) slated to have 1/3 the value of subscription streams (1,250:1), the project totals for releases relying heavily on the free tiers will decline. YouTube views will continue to be factored into the Hot 100 but not the Top 200.

 

Ad-supported streams account for 23% of the combined Spotify-Apple total and 33% of all Spotify streams, while Spotify premium and Apple contribute 48% and 29% of combined streams, respectively. With the changes, paid-only services would see an increase; services with both paid and ad-supported tiers could see a net reduction in SEA if ad-supported streams exceeded 25% of their total.

 

It would appear that most releases will see a 5-10% spike in first-week numbers, as paid streams tend to predominate in the early weeks of release; this will boost everyone’s numbers. Both Apple and the rights holders believe the changes are a step in the right direction.

 

 

In a paid streaming service you see no adds and in a free one you see adds (or is this not true?); so it's always been ambiguous to me whether an artist streamed, add-supportedly, makes less money than when streamed in a paid service. However, unless Billboard says specifically, "artists get paid more in paid-subscription services than commercial ones, and the weighting is *exactly* proportional to that", their actions look highly manipulative, as in trying to get artists to favor paid-subscription services over the commercial-supported ones. Therefore, I am highly suspicious of BB's motives for these changes (e.g., bribary by the paid services?).
 
LDR will be impacted negatively only in specific situations. However, if she streams well in paid services, she (and all others) will have a slight overall benefit (relative to the old method of counting) in terms of getting to gold/platinum certs. However, it's a negative impact for spotify on the basis of this article (and my assumptions for it, as the article is confusing AF on how much spotify is add-driven and how much is premium, and why combine apple and spotify together at times? wtf):
 
old method: X/1500 is the number of albums "sold" given X streams
new method: .48X/1250 + .52X/3750 (given ".48 of the combined spotify streams are premium and .52 add-supported").
 
Take X to be 1000000 streams, then the number albums sold in spotify is:
old: 666.666  (a good number, lol)
new: 480000/1250 + 520000/3750 = 384 +138.666 = 522.666
 
To me the old method was plenty good. I mean, even if their stream weightings are based strictly on artist revenue (and therefore rational), don't we already know that album-sales counts are not strictly based on revenue? I mean if LDR sells 2 copies of BTD digital at $5 is this counted just as much as another artist selling 1 digital album at $10? My belief is that she gets credit for 2 sales relative to the other artist's single sale, and if this is so, it makes me suspect BB's motivations for the changes even more.


#148 OFFLINE   graham4anything

graham4anything

    Advanced Member

  • Topic Starter
  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,494 posts
  • Fan Since:2005
  • Time Online: 18d 19h 33m 51s

Posted 10 May 2018 - 09:35 AM

@SLANG

 

it is though, a business, and geared toward the business

and the line nowadays is even thinner, what with both IHeart and Billboard having their own concerts/fests

and award shows, which in turn gives far more exposures to those that win those awards and support Iheart

(and the despicable Ryan Seacrest), much like at the end of each year, when they do the countdown shows,

once again those that had the biggest singles, get reexposed/ exposure giving those commercial artists the one-up.

Not going for singles also hurts an artist-oriented singer/act in that "the summer song of the year" only goes to

that song that was the biggest on the singles chart, not necessarily the best summer song of the year, or the biggest

artist.

So, no, the charts are not meant per se to the artist (and the record company is the one who has to request/pay for

the audit of the RIAA to officially get the Gold/platinum record designations (of which Born to Die has now sold

1.55million which is triple platinum but the designation don't appear until the record company officially does what

they need to do

 

As for the new system, when Lust for life was released Lana far and away had the most sales, but

under the old system(current) it enabled the other two albums to be the cause to delay that chart for a week

what with their attempt to manipulate. That being true, Lana should have an advantage for the new album

when it comes out, unless other major artists also release. (Used to be there was an orderly release schedule

known in advance that everyone kept to and played by the rules.

but "used to bees don't count anymore" as Neil Diamond wrote and sang.


Lana is our modern day Edith Piaf. Totally unique. a mixture of Brian WIlson Roy Orbison, Leonard Cohen, Gram Parsons, Elton & Bernie. Born to Die/Paradise is comparable to Elton's Captain Fantastic. All the records need to be listened whole. Waiting for a box set vinyl of all 400 songs not on any lp


#149 OFFLINE   slang

slang

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 585 posts
  • Time Online: 53d 15h 46m 16s

Posted 10 May 2018 - 01:59 PM

@SLANG

 

it is though, a business, and geared toward the business

and the line nowadays is even thinner, what with both IHeart and Billboard having their own concerts/fests

and award shows, which in turn gives far more exposures to those that win those awards and support Iheart

(and the despicable Ryan Seacrest), much like at the end of each year, when they do the countdown shows,

once again those that had the biggest singles, get reexposed/ exposure giving those commercial artists the one-up.

Not going for singles also hurts an artist-oriented singer/act in that "the summer song of the year" only goes to

that song that was the biggest on the singles chart, not necessarily the best summer song of the year, or the biggest

artist.

So, no, the charts are not meant per se to the artist (and the record company is the one who has to request/pay for

the audit of the RIAA to officially get the Gold/platinum record designations (of which Born to Die has now sold

1.55million which is triple platinum but the designation don't appear until the record company officially does what

they need to do

 

As for the new system, when Lust for life was released Lana far and away had the most sales, but

under the old system(current) it enabled the other two albums to be the cause to delay that chart for a week

what with their attempt to manipulate. That being true, Lana should have an advantage for the new album

when it comes out, unless other major artists also release. (Used to be there was an orderly release schedule

known in advance that everyone kept to and played by the rules.

but "used to bees don't count anymore" as Neil Diamond wrote and sang.

 

 


The issue for me is a personal one from my using free-spotify and appreciating a possible objective (for them) of trying to make commercial music-streaming viable like add-supported TV (which also has paid subscription services sometimes). I'm hoping the chart-stuff evolves (or at least something evolves) like the Nielsen Ratings for TV, which is also "for business", but which is supposed to be objective and non-manipulative as well. I'm waiting for spotify to voice an opinion on what went down with BB**; however, if spotify pays their artists the same per-stream under the free as paid-subscription tier (which is possibly what they do), then I would just have to conclude BB is provoking a bias in artists against add-supported streaming for greed-related reasons. I mean it's their chart they can do what they like, but they're giving me reasons to discount their chart.
 
**TBH-- I don't know if spotify is pro or con. There are complicated issues of money-incentive on all sides. While the article you cited above suggested (to me) an even split on the amount of paid/commercial-supported streams for spotify. The article below says 91% of spotify revenues (2018) comes from the paid tier, but that isn't saying 91% of the streams are from the paid tier.
 


#150 OFFLINE   graham4anything

graham4anything

    Advanced Member

  • Topic Starter
  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,494 posts
  • Fan Since:2005
  • Time Online: 18d 19h 33m 51s

Posted 10 May 2018 - 04:30 PM

@slang

 

Remember, the industry made everyone get rid of their vinyl and buy cds (and then better cds) and now when they release vinyl it is at a deluxe price in limited editions

 

so of course, it is about the money to the record companies any way one looks at it

 


Lana is our modern day Edith Piaf. Totally unique. a mixture of Brian WIlson Roy Orbison, Leonard Cohen, Gram Parsons, Elton & Bernie. Born to Die/Paradise is comparable to Elton's Captain Fantastic. All the records need to be listened whole. Waiting for a box set vinyl of all 400 songs not on any lp


#151 OFFLINE   graham4anything

graham4anything

    Advanced Member

  • Topic Starter
  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,494 posts
  • Fan Since:2005
  • Time Online: 18d 19h 33m 51s

Posted 22 May 2018 - 09:42 PM

It is now  holding at 311 which is a shame, and those are weeks one can't get back  (and now ac/dc is also back)

 

What really should be done is to add "Young and Beautiful" and a Holiday song or too, and do so immediately

there needs to be a long-term fix.

 

tbc.


  • SlowGinFizzzz likes this

Lana is our modern day Edith Piaf. Totally unique. a mixture of Brian WIlson Roy Orbison, Leonard Cohen, Gram Parsons, Elton & Bernie. Born to Die/Paradise is comparable to Elton's Captain Fantastic. All the records need to be listened whole. Waiting for a box set vinyl of all 400 songs not on any lp


#152 OFFLINE   graham4anything

graham4anything

    Advanced Member

  • Topic Starter
  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,494 posts
  • Fan Since:2005
  • Time Online: 18d 19h 33m 51s

Posted 29 May 2018 - 04:50 PM

Pure sales of Born to Die is eligible for 3x platinum  1,520,414  (it's up to the record company to officially get the RIAA to audit and do, which Lord Grange 

has not as of yet done (for whatever reason)


  • SlowGinFizzzz and surfnoirswing like this

Lana is our modern day Edith Piaf. Totally unique. a mixture of Brian WIlson Roy Orbison, Leonard Cohen, Gram Parsons, Elton & Bernie. Born to Die/Paradise is comparable to Elton's Captain Fantastic. All the records need to be listened whole. Waiting for a box set vinyl of all 400 songs not on any lp


#153 OFFLINE   graham4anything

graham4anything

    Advanced Member

  • Topic Starter
  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,494 posts
  • Fan Since:2005
  • Time Online: 18d 19h 33m 51s

Posted 09 June 2018 - 08:38 AM

June 9- It's now been 9 weeks (April 7) since Born to Die has charted

but it is still on the Alternative Album list

 

A thought comes to mind- is the album readily available in US Stores? Are new copies available or has it been sidelined to add or delete?

Enquiring minds would love to know. Because honestly have no clue as to what other reason would be.

 

Will be interesting to see what happens when the new chart method begins June 29 chart.

 

(note as always, this refers solely to the USA sales (if a person outside the country buys the album, it has to come from a USA source, not from any other nation.)


Lana is our modern day Edith Piaf. Totally unique. a mixture of Brian WIlson Roy Orbison, Leonard Cohen, Gram Parsons, Elton & Bernie. Born to Die/Paradise is comparable to Elton's Captain Fantastic. All the records need to be listened whole. Waiting for a box set vinyl of all 400 songs not on any lp


#154 OFFLINE   DAMN

DAMN

    Kungfu Kenny

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 3,490 posts
  • LocationOrlando
  • Fan Since:2013
  • Time Online: 93d 20h 58m 29s

Posted 11 June 2018 - 05:00 AM

A thought comes to mind- is the album readily available in US Stores? Are new copies available or has it been sidelined to add or delete?

 

Target, at least for me in Orlando, tend to have about 1-4 copies of it scattered in the CD section, and two of my local record stores sometimes have one copy... but thats about it


tumblr_nvz00jSRDO1uf4zrjo1_500.gif


#155 OFFLINE   graham4anything

graham4anything

    Advanced Member

  • Topic Starter
  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,494 posts
  • Fan Since:2005
  • Time Online: 18d 19h 33m 51s

Posted 11 June 2018 - 10:34 AM

Target, at least for me in Orlando, tend to have about 1-4 copies of it scattered in the CD section, and two of my local record stores sometimes have one copy... but thats about it

 

it would be interesting to know what the average number of sales both physical and digital is needed to hit the Billboard200 now

and after the change in charts in just 2 chart weeks (the new chart Tuesday will be June 15 and the change is June 29


  • DAMN likes this

Lana is our modern day Edith Piaf. Totally unique. a mixture of Brian WIlson Roy Orbison, Leonard Cohen, Gram Parsons, Elton & Bernie. Born to Die/Paradise is comparable to Elton's Captain Fantastic. All the records need to be listened whole. Waiting for a box set vinyl of all 400 songs not on any lp


#156 OFFLINE   surfnoirswing

surfnoirswing

    xx

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,066 posts
  • Fan Since:2011
  • Time Online: 14d 8h 32m 51s

Posted 11 June 2018 - 10:53 AM

it would be interesting to know what the average number of sales both physical and digital is needed to hit the Billboard200 now

and after the change in charts in just 2 chart weeks (the new chart Tuesday will be June 15 and the change is June 29

what exactly is this change in charts ?


                                                           giphy.gif


#157 OFFLINE   graham4anything

graham4anything

    Advanced Member

  • Topic Starter
  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,494 posts
  • Fan Since:2005
  • Time Online: 18d 19h 33m 51s

Posted 11 June 2018 - 12:13 PM

what exactly is this change in charts ?

 

See post 146 which is a partial article on it...

 

it is an attempt of a compromise of what happened when Lust for Life was released (and was the #1 album debut and the album that was expected to be #1) when two different rappers released and somewhat manipulated the streaming with the use of bots]

the link was 

http://m.hitsdailydo.../news&id=311689


Lana is our modern day Edith Piaf. Totally unique. a mixture of Brian WIlson Roy Orbison, Leonard Cohen, Gram Parsons, Elton & Bernie. Born to Die/Paradise is comparable to Elton's Captain Fantastic. All the records need to be listened whole. Waiting for a box set vinyl of all 400 songs not on any lp


#158 ONLINE   GroupieLove

GroupieLove

    Member

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 113 posts
  • Fan Since:1989
  • Time Online: 1d 11h 26m 7s

Posted 13 June 2018 - 01:29 PM

BTD is iconic. It will go down in history tbh.
  • Masochism and DAMN like this

#159 OFFLINE   DAMN

DAMN

    Kungfu Kenny

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 3,490 posts
  • LocationOrlando
  • Fan Since:2013
  • Time Online: 93d 20h 58m 29s

Posted 15 June 2018 - 12:04 AM

BTD is iconic. It will go down in history tbh.

 

its actually been considered as a must have album on vinyl next to Fleetwood Mac and the Beatles #shooked


  • GroupieLove likes this

tumblr_nvz00jSRDO1uf4zrjo1_500.gif





0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users