"Norman Fucking Rockwell" & "Chemtrails Over The Country Club" Album Recording/Writing Timeline + Creative Process Discussion

[Embach 42,303]

Here, we discuss about the writing/recording sessions, production, lyrics, collaborators, outtakes, visuals, themes and the behind of scenes of making of albums "Norman Fucking Rockwell!" and "Chemtrails Over The Country Club".

 

Already starting in 2017, Lana's creative process began to take a slightly different direction, completely changing with the meeting of Jack Antonoff - one of the main producers of the next five years, and now we will try to tell you how Lana's creative process went with the new producer.
 

A complete sound change in early 2018 is preceded by a six-month period in Lana's work, during which she had a writer's block and had few new ideas coming to her until late 2017, and because of that her creative journey had several paths to follow:
 

1. The release of a follow-up album to "Lust for Life, which was to include an original version of the song "Best American Record", "Silverlake" and other "Lust for Life" outtakes. Those plans were canceled after a Jack Antonoff meeting in very early 2018;
 

2. To continue working on the sixth album (which would later become "Norman Fucking Rockwell!") with Rick Nowels. So, during this period several songs were made: "Bartender" (which would later become part of the sixth album) and unknown sessions through the end of 2017, during which a number of unknown tracks were made, one of them - "Get Dark", that was recorded in September 2017.
 

But in January 2018, Lana contacted Jack, and he suggested we "meet, sit down, and just start doing something." Before meeting him, Lana expected him to have some ready-made beat ideas she could use, for Jack's production history is mostly pop-oriented, but Lana would later reveal, ". he spent hours playing chords, and he plays the piano so well that some of the things that he writes, like just melodically, really - it's kind of a classic - and in my case it ended up being more folk-oriented.", "...and in the first week I had two songs that I thought were probably the two best songs that I'd ever written." Here she's probably referring to "hope is a dangerous thing for a woman like me to have - but i have it" and "Love Song," which were ready the day Lana and Jack first met (January 29, 2018) *Lana told Vogue Korea in an interview that the process of writing "hope is a dangerous thing for a woman like me to have - but i have it" took her 3 years*.

 

For the next year and a half, Lana continued to work on the music exclusively with Jack, describing their process as "(Jack) played me five chords in a row, which ended up becoming a new song each time". Unfortunately, we are almost unaware of the timeline of Lana's creative process on her sixth album, "Norman Fucking Rockwell!", except for the dates of work on the released tracks, which are presented below:
 

- "Venice bitch" (the first version was done in February 2018 [the same version used at the end of the track "Taco Truck x VB"]; the final version was done on June 26, 2018);
- "Norman fucking Rockwell" (the track was reworked from the "Bird World" song, which was made January 29, 2018; final version made June 27, 2018);
- "Happiness is a butterfly" (originally titled "Happiness"; first version was made in March 2018; final version made June 30, 2018);
- "hope is a dangerous thing for a woman like me to have - but i have it" (originally called "Sylvia" and "Sylvia Plath"; first version made January 29, 2018; final version made August 4, 2018);
- "Love Song" (first version made January 29, 2018; final version made August 6, 2018);
- "Mariners apartment complex" (originally titled "I'm Your Man"; first version made February 2018; final version made August 31, 2018);
- "Cinnamon Girl" (originally titled "Cinnamon"; first version made October 2018; final version made December 18, 2018);
- "California" (track is a reworking of a song from 2017; final version made January 18, 2019);
- "How to disappear" (first version made in October 2018; final version made January 20, 2019);
- "The greatest" (first version made in 2018/2019; final version made February 13, 2019);

Undisclosed dates:
- "Bartender" (the track was made in 2017 with Rick Nowles; for the first time, Lana revealed the track's existence on January 28, 2018, and said it "does not yet belong on an upcoming record"; the track played on Lana's sister Chuck Grant [Chuck Grant]'s Instagram Stories on May 10, 2018);
- "The Next Best American Record" (a reworked version of the track "Best American Record"; it is unknown when Lana reworked the track and when it became part of her sixth album);
 

RMF Classic Radio on November 3, 2018 once again confirmed what Lana had said on September 18, 2018, that the album was to be released in late March and that there would be 11 tracks on it (which ones are unknown). Also, in December 2018, MTV UK reported that the album would be released on March 29, 2019, and in December, Lana reported that the album was completely finished and also liked an article stating a March release date for the album.

 

Up to March 29th, various information from different sources kept coming in, either denying or confirming the album's release in March. But when March 29th came, the album was not released for unknown reasons.
 

Over the next 5 months, Lana makes two new songs for the record (Doin' Time [April 2019] and Fuck it I love you [July 2019]), and the world premiere of Lana's sixth studio album Norman Fucking Rockwell! took place on August 30, 2019, and songs made during sessions for the album but not included are:
 

- "Not All Who Wonder Are Lost" (originally titled "Wanderlust"; the track was made during the sessions for "Norman Fucking Rockwell!" but the original version was released on the next album, "Chemtrails Over the Country Club");
- "Valley of the Dolls" (concept demo, was made February 14, 2017 during sessions with The Last Shadow Puppets; later sent as a track idea along with some other unknown tracks for revision to Jack Antonoff; the track was never revised by him);
- "LA Who Am I" (snippet; the track was likely made just for fun, and is a reworked version of the track "LA Who Am I to Love You" from 2016);
- "Talking like an Answering Machine" (the song was first listed on Buma/Sterma and there were rumors that the song was not made until 2018; the chances that the song is real and refers to Lana are higher than that the song is unreal);
- "Bombastic" Outtakes (told by Jack Antonoff during an interview that tracks with an "explosive" sound were made during the sessions for the album that remain unleaked);
- Rick Nowels Outtakes (it was revealed that there are songs made by Rick Nowels for the sixth studio album that remain unleaked).

- "Jimmy" part from "A&W" (In an interview for Rolling Stones, Jack Antonoff talked about the process of making "Jimmy" and "that they had created a while back" suggesting that it was made during the NFR sessions).

 

Thank you for the information @lanaismamom 

[americangothic 1,690]

I still remember the days we only knew the title of "Bartender". Those were the days.

[Embach 42,303]

1 minute ago, americangothic said:

I still remember the days we only knew the title of "Bartender". Those were the days.

And when the album was released, we found out that Chuck's random Insta story from Summer 2018 was playing Bartender 😭

[americangothic 1,690]

What we know:

 

• If I recall correct the first songs she did with Jack were 'Love Song' and 'Hope is a Dangerous Thing...'.

 

• She already had "California" and "The Next Best American Record" from previous projects.

 

• "Doin' Time" was a last minute addition to the album.

 

• The last song worked on was "Fuck It I Love You", that's why the production changed on the digital version?

[Embach 42,303]

Info found - added to the op

Edited June 19, 2023 by Embach
Info is found

[BartenderDeco 19,636]

I wonder what the og concept was when she was working with rick

like from the snippets we have, poetry in motion, get dark and la who am i

[Embach 42,303]

Andrew Watt worked on both Doin' Time and FIILY (with Louis Bell). I wonder if they have more songs together.

[ShadesOfViolence 6,658]

we want rick songs from nfr sessions

[americangothic 1,690]

10 minutes ago, ShadesOfViolence said:

we want rick songs from nfr sessions

Do we know if they worked on more songs other than "Bartender" and "Happiness is a Butterfly" during this era? (not counting "TNBAR"). This is a pivotal moment in her working methodology and creative process, and what I personally refer to the 'Jack Antonoff Replacing Rick Nowels Tragedy' (as a joke, tho). What I mean is that; once she met Jack, something happened to the way she worked with Rick — as in 'basically they most likely never worked together on new songs again post-NFR!'.

[Embach 42,303]

Hey @Unknown, no pressure, but do you have any interesting tea about NFR era? 

[viktoria 3,176]

i would love to know the draft tracklist for the 11 track version of the album. presumably doin time and fiily weren't on it but what other song wasn't....

[wilting daisy 3,395]

are we positive not all who wander are lost is from the nfr sessions? bc lyrically it sounds like she wrote it after nfr. she mentions the midwest and a christian man which both seem to reference her relationship with sean which didn't start til after norman was released. is there an early demo with completely different lyrics in the verses? i feel like that would be the only way it would be possible for it to be from the nfr sessions unless she's clairvoyant 

[Embach 42,303]

13 minutes ago, wilting daisy said:

are we positive not all who wander are lost is from the nfr sessions? bc lyrically it sounds like she wrote it after nfr. she mentions the midwest and a christian man which both seem to reference her relationship with sean which didn't start til after norman was released. is there an early demo with completely different lyrics in the verses? i feel like that would be the only way it would be possible for it to be from the nfr sessions unless she's clairvoyant 

Jack said in an interview that when he was working with Lana, they were sorting out songs, there were:

• NFR songs

• Bombastic songs

• Quiet songs

 

So I think that they made it during the NFR sessions and when they started "sorting", then they put it in the quiet songs section.

 

[hotshot2am 18,781]

You should also add that the Jimmy part (from A&W) is from early NFR sessions. There's a second source for it where Jack talks about not opening his emails for months, but I somehow can't find it.

 

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-features/lana-del-rey-collaborations-jack-antonoff-ocean-blvd-1234705643

 

Then, in the spirit of one-upping each other, Antonoff suggested that they finally find a home for a twisted, trap-beat freak-out, called “Jimmy,” that they had created a while back. He sewed the two parts together with some modular synths and synthetic drums, to his engineer Laura Sisk’s absolute delight: “I remember Laura clenched her fists and was really excited about it and said ‘Jimmy’s gonna live.’”

[Embach 42,303]

12 minutes ago, hotshot2am said:

You should also add that the Jimmy part (from A&W) is from early NFR sessions. There's a second source for it where Jack talks about not opening his emails for months, but I somehow can't find it.

 

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-features/lana-del-rey-collaborations-jack-antonoff-ocean-blvd-1234705643

 

Then, in the spirit of one-upping each other, Antonoff suggested that they finally find a home for a twisted, trap-beat freak-out, called “Jimmy,” that they had created a while back. He sewed the two parts together with some modular synths and synthetic drums, to his engineer Laura Sisk’s absolute delight: “I remember Laura clenched her fists and was really excited about it and said ‘Jimmy’s gonna live.’”

Thank you ❤

[Crazy Husband Thief 3,904]

I don’t hate this album nearly as much as I used to anymore but I hate the musical direction for future albums that it initiated. It was definitely an interesting change of sound and aesthetics for her looking back and earned her a lot of acclaim (unfortunately overshadowed by QFTC).

 

I still believe that Lana could and should really surprise us with an entirely new (or maybe old) production. Her unreleased catalogue is getting so hyped and if she used that hype to go back to the soundscape of Queen of Disaster, MMITPM, Dangerous Girl, Driving in Cars… now that could make her a massive trendsetter again. No one is currently doing that type of music right now but TikTok would EAT THAT SHIT UP.

 

It's obviously never gonna happen cause she is kinda too old to be making that type of music but a gay can dream…

[wilting daisy 3,395]

32 minutes ago, Embach said:

Jack said in an interview that when he was working with Lana, they were sorting out songs, there were:

• NFR songs

• Bombastic songs

• Quiet songs

 

So I think that they made it during the NFR sessions and when they started "sorting", then they put it in the quiet songs section.

 

but where did he say not all who wander are lost was specifically one of the quieter songs they worked on during the norman sessions? while some songs from chemtrails seemed to come from the norman sessions, clearly the whole album wasn't written then and not all who wander are lost lyrically seems like something she wrote later about her relationship with sean unless there's a demo from those sessions that has completely different lyrics.

[Veinsineon 76,782]

I think all the quiet songs from Norman made their way onto Blue Banisters / COTCC

[lemonadetan 5,086]

i think honeymouns confirmed not all who wander are lost is from nfr

[Veinsineon 76,782]

Also remember when we had all the snippets and had names for them like In Your Car and In My Arms 

2 minutes ago, lemonadetan said:

i think honeymouns confirmed not all who wander are lost is from nfr

They did and original title is WANDERLUST