Honeymoon - Post-Release Discussion Thread + Poll

[wittycatchphrase 1,399]

What's his Twitter

[Limelight 4,709]

TBD's one of Lana's best songs ever. The way the chorus kicks in

[delreyfreak 5,342]

Did you know that UV's least-streamed song has more streams than half of HM? http://lanaboards.com/index.php?/topic/6400-lanas-streaming-power-updated-jan-2016/

The album's also been out for more than a year. If you wait another year for Honeymoon and then compare the stream count to the current numbers of UV, they'd probably be similar??

[PARADIXO 33,124]

The album's also been out for more than a year. If you wait another year for Honeymoon and then compare the stream count to the current numbers of UV, they'd probably be similar??

 

Well, UV has been streamed over half a billion times. I don't really think HM will reach that.

[naachoboy 7,993]

Well, UV has been streamed over half a billion times. I don't really think HM will reach that.

it wont if Lana doesnt get her shit together and doesnt release a good video lmao 

[sparklrtrailrheaven 9,124]

I'm starting to believe that I've figured out Honeymoon, somewhat. I think (and I might wince at this theory later) that Honeymoon is Lana's critique of fame/the industry, and some of it is her making fun of herself/the stereotypes that surround her. I mean, maybe this is nothing new, but I'd like to put my two cents in.

I'll put my Lanalysis™ in the spoiler (warning, this is NOT polished, and is very speculative, very messy, but I need to get these thoughts out):

 

Okay, I'll do this track-by-track:

 

Honeymoon: I've heard Lana criticized as having too slow of a sound/too disinterested of a voice, etc. (for ex. I read some review comparing Lana's style to her being on cough syrup), and the title track seems like she's playing on that. It's one of Lana's longest released tracks (I can't speak for the unreleased), and to me, it seems intentionally drawn out, and intentionally repetitive. ("Dark blue", "Our Honeymoon", etc.) In the bridge, it goes into flowery (literally!) prose that uses classic Lana-stock: blazing guns, roses, the "mob-moll/dangerous girl" image. Basically, I think this song is Lana's summation of how the critics simplify her style-- melodramatic, slow and emotionless, repetitive, playing on cliches.

 

Music To Watch Boys To: I'm not completely sure what to make of this one yet, but I'll give it a shot. With MTWBT, I think Lana gets broader with her focus, and starts critiquing "ready-made" singers-- people who pay their way into becoming an artist, something Lana has been accused of. The lyrics border on being vapid, and to me sound like they're trying hard to sound "cool"-- referencing Pabst Blue Ribbon (I know Lana's referenced it before, but shut up), which has been referred to as a "hipster" beer, and "soft grunge". (In the case of soft grunge, it's often referred to as being a pretentious term, such as its' definition on Urban Dictionary) It's like a teenager's inflated diary, comparing a concept as heavy as love to lemonade and summer, or boosting her own ego and reputation by painting herself as manipulative and "set to destroy". (HALSEY DISS TRACK CONFIRMED jk)

 

Terrence Loves You: No idea, tbh. Input welcome as to how this could fit into my theme.

 

God Knows I Tried: I think this is universally accepted (and pretty obvious for the most part), but this is Lana's response to the critics. She's saying that she's really been through struggles, she's not making up an image. She's trying her hardest, and still gets criticized-- it makes her sick of fame, hence the reason she "feel free" when "nobody knows [her] name".

 

High By the Beach: I honestly feel like this pairs with GKIT as another response to the critics?? This opinion was kind of influenced by the annotations on Genius, but I agree. Lana's expressing this desire to get away from all the fame and the "bullshit", and telling the critics how she never even bought into it when they "pay tribute to [her]" because they're hypocrites. The "lights, camera, accion" bridge doubly means that she hasn't bought her way to fame like some would guess. She'll "do it on her own", and doesn't need "your money"-- she's worked for this, and the reference to PMIAM is like a reference to AKA, showing that she was making music before the instant success of Video Games. As for the verses, I feel like they could actually be addressed to the fans and the critics-- maybe? The first verse refers to the fans: we're "looking at [her]", "[knowing] how [she] feels"-- we really "get" her. However, her fame is becoming "surreal" and too much to stand. She loves us, but can't handle the pressure. The second verse takes shots at the critics, telling them that they "don't understand", and tells them that their position of power ("bad motherfucker") doesn't "make them a man". In other words, they may think they've got the upper hand because of their power, but she knows that they really don't mean a thing. Now they're her "problems" because they "got out of hand"-- made too many assumptions, got too personal, etc.

 

Freak: While GKIT and HBTB show the true nature of fame, Freak is like the idealized version of fame-- a typical dream of California: an "endless summer", a constant party, where your past is forgotten ("stranger than a stranger" still kills me).

 

Art Deco: I think Art Deco could be Lana's idolatry of the woman she wishes she could be sometimes: this "club queen" embraces her fame, "stay[ing] in the light". She ignores those who bother her, and "put [her] life on the line". In other words, fame has caused this ideal woman to prosper and has led her to the party lifestyle envisioned in "Freak". Art Deco is like "Freak" pt. 2-- Lana's dream of idyllic partying in California is accompanied by a dream of the woman who thrives in this lifestyle.

 

Burnt Norton (Interlude): This is the track to me that ties it all together, explaining that she's in somewhat different personas for the album, but my idea is too messy to even post, haha

 

Religion: In my theory, Religion is the piece that ties the GKIT/HBTB and Freak/AD pairs together. F/AD are Lana's dreams of what fame would be like before she had it, but GKIT/HBTB are the realities. In Religion, however, the now-jaded Lana returns to dreaming. She dismisses the idealizations of F/AD ("It was never about the party or the clubs") and creates a new dream for herself: a perfect lover guides her out of the troubled world she's in now, into an almost childishly perfect land of beauty and happiness, where she can "leave it all behind, let the ocean wash away".

 

Salvatore: See "Honeymoon". I think Salvatore could be a similar lampooning of Lana's supposed style, this time addressing the "mob moll/bad boy" personas in more detail. The similar melodrama of Honeymoon is here, along with what could be Lana's parody of claims that she has been guilty of cultural appropriation-- she almost mindlessly rambles and jumbles Italian iconography in the song (limousines, cacciatore, Salvatore, ciao amore, etc.)

 

The Blackest Day: I don't want to be too quick to say anything about this song, but for now, I'm putting it in the "subtle parody" category with HM and Salvatore, as a play on Lana's "sad-core" image. (blackest day, deader than ever, darker and darker, etc.)

 

24: Bond song, plain and simple. Lana's been compared to Bond singers for years, so she took the jump and did an explicitly Bond song.

 

Swan Song: Think Religion, pt. 2. Another dream of what she could have, except this one is not as tinged in unbelievability as Religion. Sure, she's still wishing she could get away from fame, but this time it's attainable.

 

Don't Let Me Be Misunderstood: A final plea to the public explaining that she has worked, she is honest, and she is human. Although, this one is pretty self explanatory!

 

So, I think Honeymoon can be split into a few 'parts':

Part 1: Freak and Art Deco: Lana's dreams of fame and celebrity, before ever having it.

Part 2: GKIT and HBTB: Lana has fame, but is overwhelmed by pressure and criticism.

Part 3: HM, MTWBT, Salvatore, TBD, 24: Lana subtly parodies the stereotypes (cough syrup-y chanteuse, ready-made daddy's girl pop starlet, culturally appropriating bad-girl wannabe, sad-core siren, and Bond singer, respectively) and criticisms placed upon her by making them into actual songs.

Part 4: Religion and Swan Song: Lana dreams of what life could be like without fame.

Part 5: BN and DLMBM: Lana firstly ties it all together with a discussion on how her past, present, and stereotyped selves all have the potential to exist and all exist within her, and then gives a final plea to understand the parts of her and what she has brought forth on the album.

 

Where does TLY fit in??!!!

 

Anyway.... that was a hot mess, but I'd like to hear your thoughts. I'm going to refine this a lot more soon, hopefully, and I hope it isn't just a rehash of what someone else has come up with.

 

Go easy on me and don't let me be misunderstood, fam

[Ben Mawson 369]

Well, I don’t like that Mawson guy a bit

The feeling's mutual buddy.

[Trash Magic 28,474]

I find nothing more pedantic than to pick lines out of songs and individually criticise them without considering the lyrics as a whole. lmao

[PARADIXO 33,124]

.

[JizzyLizzy 437]

lana: *farts*

 

everyone: tour dates coming soon I can feel it

[strange weather 1,954]

I'm starting to believe that I've figured out Honeymoon, somewhat. I think (and I might wince at this theory later) that Honeymoon is Lana's critique of fame/the industry, and some of it is her making fun of herself/the stereotypes that surround her. I mean, maybe this is nothing new, but I'd like to put my two cents in.

I'll put my Lanalysis™ in the spoiler (warning, this is NOT polished, and is very speculative, very messy, but I need to get these thoughts out):

 

i think you are reaching for the moon & the stars here, tbh. you really think that lana would make an entire album parodying stereotypes about herself? remember how critics thought that brooklyn baby was doing that & she was being serious?   (MPG is a different story buuut it's not on honeymoon either.)

 

it may be nice to think that the cliches/repetitiveness/slowness were done for some grand reason, but what sense would that make? nah, it's just what it is on the surface.

 

there are definitely critiques about fame, though. 

[LittleFool 1,912]

I'm starting to believe that I've figured out Honeymoon, somewhat. I think (and I might wince at this theory later) that Honeymoon is Lana's critique of fame/the industry, and some of it is her making fun of herself/the stereotypes that surround her. I mean, maybe this is nothing new, but I'd like to put my two cents in.

I'll put my Lanalysis™ in the spoiler (warning, this is NOT polished, and is very speculative, very messy, but I need to get these thoughts out):

 

Okay, I'll do this track-by-track:

 

Honeymoon: I've heard Lana criticized as having too slow of a sound/too disinterested of a voice, etc. (for ex. I read some review comparing Lana's style to her being on cough syrup), and the title track seems like she's playing on that. It's one of Lana's longest released tracks (I can't speak for the unreleased), and to me, it seems intentionally drawn out, and intentionally repetitive. ("Dark blue", "Our Honeymoon", etc.) In the bridge, it goes into flowery (literally!) prose that uses classic Lana-stock: blazing guns, roses, the "mob-moll/dangerous girl" image. Basically, I think this song is Lana's summation of how the critics simplify her style-- melodramatic, slow and emotionless, repetitive, playing on cliches.

 

Music To Watch Boys To: I'm not completely sure what to make of this one yet, but I'll give it a shot. With MTWBT, I think Lana gets broader with her focus, and starts critiquing "ready-made" singers-- people who pay their way into becoming an artist, something Lana has been accused of. The lyrics border on being vapid, and to me sound like they're trying hard to sound "cool"-- referencing Pabst Blue Ribbon (I know Lana's referenced it before, but shut up), which has been referred to as a "hipster" beer, and "soft grunge". (In the case of soft grunge, it's often referred to as being a pretentious term, such as its' definition on Urban Dictionary) It's like a teenager's inflated diary, comparing a concept as heavy as love to lemonade and summer, or boosting her own ego and reputation by painting herself as manipulative and "set to destroy". (HALSEY DISS TRACK CONFIRMED jk)

 

Terrence Loves You: No idea, tbh. Input welcome as to how this could fit into my theme.

 

God Knows I Tried: I think this is universally accepted (and pretty obvious for the most part), but this is Lana's response to the critics. She's saying that she's really been through struggles, she's not making up an image. She's trying her hardest, and still gets criticized-- it makes her sick of fame, hence the reason she "feel free" when "nobody knows [her] name".

 

High By the Beach: I honestly feel like this pairs with GKIT as another response to the critics?? This opinion was kind of influenced by the annotations on Genius, but I agree. Lana's expressing this desire to get away from all the fame and the "bullshit", and telling the critics how she never even bought into it when they "pay tribute to [her]" because they're hypocrites. The "lights, camera, accion" bridge doubly means that she hasn't bought her way to fame like some would guess. She'll "do it on her own", and doesn't need "your money"-- she's worked for this, and the reference to PMIAM is like a reference to AKA, showing that she was making music before the instant success of Video Games. As for the verses, I feel like they could actually be addressed to the fans and the critics-- maybe? The first verse refers to the fans: we're "looking at [her]", "[knowing] how [she] feels"-- we really "get" her. However, her fame is becoming "surreal" and too much to stand. She loves us, but can't handle the pressure. The second verse takes shots at the critics, telling them that they "don't understand", and tells them that their position of power ("bad motherfucker") doesn't "make them a man". In other words, they may think they've got the upper hand because of their power, but she knows that they really don't mean a thing. Now they're her "problems" because they "got out of hand"-- made too many assumptions, got too personal, etc.

 

Freak: While GKIT and HBTB show the true nature of fame, Freak is like the idealized version of fame-- a typical dream of California: an "endless summer", a constant party, where your past is forgotten ("stranger than a stranger" still kills me).

 

Art Deco: I think Art Deco could be Lana's idolatry of the woman she wishes she could be sometimes: this "club queen" embraces her fame, "stay[ing] in the light". She ignores those who bother her, and "put [her] life on the line". In other words, fame has caused this ideal woman to prosper and has led her to the party lifestyle envisioned in "Freak". Art Deco is like "Freak" pt. 2-- Lana's dream of idyllic partying in California is accompanied by a dream of the woman who thrives in this lifestyle.

 

Burnt Norton (Interlude): This is the track to me that ties it all together, explaining that she's in somewhat different personas for the album, but my idea is too messy to even post, haha

 

Religion: In my theory, Religion is the piece that ties the GKIT/HBTB and Freak/AD pairs together. F/AD are Lana's dreams of what fame would be like before she had it, but GKIT/HBTB are the realities. In Religion, however, the now-jaded Lana returns to dreaming. She dismisses the idealizations of F/AD ("It was never about the party or the clubs") and creates a new dream for herself: a perfect lover guides her out of the troubled world she's in now, into an almost childishly perfect land of beauty and happiness, where she can "leave it all behind, let the ocean wash away".

 

Salvatore: See "Honeymoon". I think Salvatore could be a similar lampooning of Lana's supposed style, this time addressing the "mob moll/bad boy" personas in more detail. The similar melodrama of Honeymoon is here, along with what could be Lana's parody of claims that she has been guilty of cultural appropriation-- she almost mindlessly rambles and jumbles Italian iconography in the song (limousines, cacciatore, Salvatore, ciao amore, etc.)

 

The Blackest Day: I don't want to be too quick to say anything about this song, but for now, I'm putting it in the "subtle parody" category with HM and Salvatore, as a play on Lana's "sad-core" image. (blackest day, deader than ever, darker and darker, etc.)

 

24: Bond song, plain and simple. Lana's been compared to Bond singers for years, so she took the jump and did an explicitly Bond song.

 

Swan Song: Think Religion, pt. 2. Another dream of what she could have, except this one is not as tinged in unbelievability as Religion. Sure, she's still wishing she could get away from fame, but this time it's attainable.

 

Don't Let Me Be Misunderstood: A final plea to the public explaining that she has worked, she is honest, and she is human. Although, this one is pretty self explanatory!

 

So, I think Honeymoon can be split into a few 'parts':

Part 1: Freak and Art Deco: Lana's dreams of fame and celebrity, before ever having it.

Part 2: GKIT and HBTB: Lana has fame, but is overwhelmed by pressure and criticism.

Part 3: HM, MTWBT, Salvatore, TBD, 24: Lana subtly parodies the stereotypes (cough syrup-y chanteuse, ready-made daddy's girl pop starlet, culturally appropriating bad-girl wannabe, sad-core siren, and Bond singer, respectively) and criticisms placed upon her by making them into actual songs.

Part 4: Religion and Swan Song: Lana dreams of what life could be like without fame.

Part 5: BN and DLMBM: Lana firstly ties it all together with a discussion on how her past, present, and stereotyped selves all have the potential to exist and all exist within her, and then gives a final plea to understand the parts of her and what she has brought forth on the album.

 

Where does TLY fit in??!!!

 

Anyway.... that was a hot mess, but I'd like to hear your thoughts. I'm going to refine this a lot more soon, hopefully, and I hope it isn't just a rehash of what someone else has come up with.

 

Go easy on me and don't let me be misunderstood, fam

I agree to an extent. Part of me is convinced, though, that she has actually become a parody of herself lol

[sparklrtrailrheaven 9,124]

i think you are reaching for the moon & the stars here, tbh. you really think that lana would make an entire album parodying stereotypes about herself? remember how critics thought that brooklyn baby was doing that & she was being serious?   (MPG is a different story buuut it's not on honeymoon either.)

 

it may be nice to think that the cliches/repetitiveness/slowness were done for some grand reason, but what sense would that make? nah, it's just what it is on the surface.

 

there are definitely critiques about fame, though. 

 

you make good points! but, adversely, how can we say that Lana's not parodying the stereotypes? I wouldn't put it past her to create an accessible album that's also a slap at the naysayers.

 

LOOK I JUST DON'T WANT TO BELIEVE THAT SHE CAME OUT WITH SOMETHING I DON'T LIKE MUCH SO LET ME HAVE MY THEORIES TO JUSTIFY IT  

[naachoboy 7,993]

.

 

 

When they write about 24 "theres only 24 hours in a day" and then they are like: as if we didnt know ...

 

But im like bitch the lyrics dont stop there, dumb ass bitch.

[Solar Fields 4,163]

tbh I think a lot of the songs on this album are just Lana being herself and having fun. MTWBT, Honeymoon, Freak, and Art Deco are the best examples.

[DeadAgainst 1,515]

I'm starting to believe that I've figured out Honeymoon, somewhat. I think (and I might wince at this theory later) that Honeymoon is Lana's critique of fame/the industry, and some of it is her making fun of herself/the stereotypes that surround her. I mean, maybe this is nothing new, but I'd like to put my two cents in.

I'll put my Lanalysis™ in the spoiler (warning, this is NOT polished, and is very speculative, very messy, but I need to get these thoughts out):

 

I get this because I also engage in continuous sardonic self-parody while remaining entirely sincere

[DeadAgainst 1,515]

Honeymoon has the sound of analog tape, which gives it that distinctively fuzzy sound, but recorded on Solid State which gives it that antiseptic Rick Nowels studio soud

 

To really get that vintage aesthetic, the missing component is that she needs to use tube amplification (fortunately, that FLAC vinyl corrects this oversight)

[Edelgard 1,849]

do you guys think we'll have an album this year? HM came exactly a year ish after UV.

[PARADIXO 33,124]

do you guys think we'll have an album this year? HM came exactly a year ish after UV.

 

no and i hope we dont

[TRENCH 15,450]

As much as i love Lana and any song that she'll release, she should take a break and plan a bit more for her next step...OR actually film some music videos and finish the last two era's that she left deserted