MARINA (and The Diamonds)

[ChaoticLipster 24,735]

Marina is one of these people where she will say something smart and then something utterly Ignorant on a matter without even basic research.  

[Tana Mongeau 4,989]

2 minutes ago, AllForYou said:

it’s a shame she’ll never really play those songs again because they’re associated with Jack. you, too afraid and true might never be played live now.
 

you and true are weird choices to never play live imo, she said she imagined playing true in a club with her friends and ‘you’ seems like a great ‘pass the mic over’ opportunity I know most people enjoy the demo more but it would still be good live I think. 

she should've included STBS and HaHe on the ADIAML tour too, tbf I get her other albums are more well received, but I feel that they could've fit with the ADIAML tour 'aesthetic' if you get me? 

[vrtvie 2,275]

16 hours ago, evalionisameme said:

Handmade heaven is one of her best leads, sorry 

i do like handmade heaven, but from what i've observed many people were already bitter about her stage name change, collaboration with clean bandit was rather questionable to say the least, and then handmade heaven was definitely not catchy enough to keep them interested. then superstar (overhated) and orange trees happened, when the album was announced the artwork was so bland it still hurts, later she claimed L+F to be her best album so people grew very big expectations and were disappointed heavily. stop pretending that any please don't call me or holiday would've changed that because we all know it wouldn't, later on she was sooo depressed by the fandom reception that she had nightmares about planes crashing, and, to be honest, listening to this record feels quite uncomfortable after that. and marina is to blame here as well because aside from the music she clearly had no vision for this era. she just doesn't spend that much time on her work as she used to it seems.

[Tana Mongeau 4,989]

3 minutes ago, vrtvie said:

i do like handmade heaven, but from what i've observed many people were already bitter about her stage name change, collaboration with clean bandit was rather questionable to say the least, and then handmade heaven was definitely not catchy enough to keep them interested. then superstar (overhated) and orange trees happened

I feel like what let superstar down was the overly electronic production, I feel like it is a good song but could've been a cute intimate song, but the vocal effects (and that fucking bass) kind of let it down? I prefer the acoustic version much more. Nothing can ever save Orange Tress because oh my fucking god what was that. the guitar is so copied and pasted so badly it hurts, i think the lyrics are cute in some places, but the production killed it for me. The production for handmade heaven and to be human was very well articulated in my opinion though, I don't know how else to describe it lmao

[vrtvie 2,275]

2 hours ago, AllForYou said:

and as much as I would like die life and electra heart, atlantic (or just her manager) made the right call by not allowing her to do it.

I agree with most of you said in this thread but this definitely not. Her manager Derek MacKillop did not allow her to make Die Life because she wanted it to be exclusively under Marina brand and Electra Heart to be her seperate identity, which I think would be absolutely glorious because she would simultaneously not offend her previous TFJ fans (who were also disgusted by EH sound, really, British press especially) and still hit the charts. She had hits in EH era not because she was already known thanks to TFJ but because they had great pop potential and big producers. Also her anonymity would sparkle even more interest I suppose. Unfortunately no label would make such a risk and fund two albums at the same time and spend money on a big pop campaign with Dr. Luke production and Madonna/Katy Perry ambitions for Marina's experiment, technically a brand new artist.

[AllForYou 1,721]

23 minutes ago, vrtvie said:

I agree with most of you said in this thread but this definitely not. Her manager Derek MacKillop did not allow her to make Die Life because she wanted it to be exclusively under Marina brand and Electra Heart to be her seperate identity, which I think would be absolutely glorious because she would simultaneously not offend her previous TFJ fans (who were also disgusted by EH sound, really, British press especially) and still hit the charts. She had hits in EH era not because she was already known thanks to TFJ but because they had great pop potential and big producers. Also her anonymity would sparkle even more interest I suppose. Unfortunately no label would make such a risk and fund two albums at the same time and spend money on a big pop campaign with Dr. Luke production and Madonna/Katy Perry ambitions for Marina's experiment, technically a brand new artist.

honestly, I 100% agree with you, but as I said in the next sentence 'Marina has her heart in the right place but she tends to overpromise what she’s capable of doing'

I believe if she had done two projects at the same time, she would have done the two of them badly, (aka not up to standard). rather than the iconic electra heart/die Life era we all want and deserved, obviously we'll never know if she wanted to actually do them simultaneously, but I'm just taking that at face value that was her plan. she couldn't even put out those homemade videos for the 3 archetypes we're missing. (I understand maybe she didn't have the budget for the gallery/exhibition she wanted but an official photobook would have been great).

[Tana Mongeau 4,989]

25 minutes ago, vrtvie said:

I agree with most of you said in this thread but this definitely not. Her manager Derek MacKillop did not allow her to make Die Life because she wanted it to be exclusively under Marina brand and Electra Heart to be her seperate identity, which I think would be absolutely glorious because she would simultaneously not offend her previous TFJ fans (who were also disgusted by EH sound, really, British press especially) and still hit the charts. She had hits in EH era not because she was already known thanks to TFJ but because they had great pop potential and big producers. Also her anonymity would sparkle even more interest I suppose. Unfortunately no label would make such a risk and fund two albums at the same time and spend money on a big pop campaign with Dr. Luke production and Madonna/Katy Perry ambitions for Marina's experiment, technically a brand new artist.

I agree with you. I think if she had done this, she wouldn't have alienated her original fanbase, been able to feel more 'authentic' (she said she felt like a different person when she was electra heart and she couldve felt more authentic if electra heart was a side project and people knew that) but also she could've gone after that commercial success, just in a different way. I feel like the alienation continued into FROOT too, like she went the complete opposite direction of electra and electra stans were like what. i think if she did die Life by MATD, even as an EP or album PRIOR to electra, it would've bridged the massive sound change more, maybe? i dont know. i feel it couldve made the original fans more happy tbh

Edited February 7, 2023 by 132
lol i accidentally posted

[FkaTwinks 3,135]

6 minutes ago, AllForYou said:

she couldn't even put out those homemade videos for the 3 archetypes we're missing

I don't get how she even fumbled that

they were potato-quality photoshoot B-roll footage set to GarageBand edits of existing album tracks

[Tana Mongeau 4,989]

8 minutes ago, AllForYou said:

3 archetypes we're missing. (I understand maybe she didn't have the budget for the gallery/exhibition she wanted but an official photobook would have been great).

yeah apparently there were several scrapped archetypes that were merged. kind of a shame but also kinda glad because i feel if there was even more it wouldve been half assed

[AllForYou 1,721]

33 minutes ago, AlexIl said:

I don't get how she even fumbled that

they were potato-quality photoshoot B-roll footage set to GarageBand edits of existing album tracks

right? I'm also mad we didn't get more of the b-roll footage, she fumbled making them herself then fumbled an opportunity of just posting them to tumblr and letting her fans make their own edits. I think that b-roll footage should have been used in the title track's music video, that video was such a letdown when I saw it (it's still iconic though)

30 minutes ago, 132 said:

yeah apparently there were several scrapped archetypes that were merged. kind of a shame but also kinda glad because i feel if there was even more it wouldve been half assed

I think they were more sub-types under the archetypes (a bubblegum bitch being under teen idle), but I agree, I'm glad she realised that early on though

edit so I don't double post: one thing about the 'british press hated electra heart' whilst true, and likely due to misogyny, she did badly explain the concept in the beginning. people thought it was an alter ego, then she had to retract that. (maybe she wanted it to be an 'alter ego' at first and then realised people didn't like that idea and decided to retcon it)

[Tana Mongeau 4,989]

35 minutes ago, AllForYou said:

I think they were more sub-types under the archetypes (a bubblegum bitch being under teen idle), but I agree, I'm glad she realised that early on though

edit so I don't double post: one thing about the 'british press hated electra heart' whilst true, and likely due to misogyny, she did badly explain the concept in the beginning. people thought it was an alter ego, then she had to retract that. (maybe she wanted it to be an 'alter ego' at first and then realised people didn't like that idea and decided to retcon it)

it was also the fact that old men were reviewing her work so they were so brutal. one music critic outlet (clash music) literally retracted their original review saying it was unpleasant, cruel, rude and offensive. 

[evalionisameme 13,900]

I mean a lot of people saw Marina as a sellout trying to one up lady Gaga and Katy Perry-the critics that loved her as an “indie” darling were mad

[AllForYou 1,721]

6 minutes ago, 132 said:

it was also the fact that old men were reviewing her work so they were so brutal. one music critic outlet (clash music) literally retracted their original review saying it was unpleasant, cruel, rude and offensive. 

this too! the pitchfork one is gross. I didn't mean to sound unsympathetic or anything, just that her not explaining the concept probably didn't help her situation, though probably more with her fans than her critics.

[AllForYou 1,721]

7 minutes ago, evalionisameme said:

I mean a lot of people saw Marina as a sellout trying to one up lady Gaga and Katy Perry-the critics that loved her as an “indie” darling were mad

true, this isn't helped when she also slagged off Dr. Luke and Katy Perry and other female artists that work with his 'hit factory' that 'good pop songs come out [of] but have no originality', people must have had severe whiplash

[Tana Mongeau 4,989]

8 minutes ago, AllForYou said:

this too! the pitchfork one is gross. I didn't mean to sound unsympathetic or anything, just that her not explaining the concept probably didn't help her situation, though probably more with her fans than her critics.

no you're fine don't worry, I was just expanding on what you said

[AtomicMess 3,490]

1 hour ago, 132 said:

I feel like the alienation continued into FROOT too, like she went the complete opposite direction of electra and electra stans were like what. 

It's me, Hi!, I'm the Stan it's me.

FROOT hit and the title track managed to choke slam me from the moment it appeared, but everything else on the album sat in a gutter for a few years until my tastes changed and allowed the rest of the album to exist for me.

 

EH hit and hit hard for me - probably a mix of who I was and where I was in life at the time it was released - and anything that wasn't *that* by her just felt like shit to my ears for a long time.

[AtomicMess 3,490]

1 hour ago, 132 said:

 i think if she did die Life by MATD, even as an EP or album PRIOR to electra, it would've bridged the massive sound change more, maybe? 

For me, yes. Listening to TFJ and then going to EH, massive sonic shift. But then listening to all of the leaked demos and outtakes between the two and what was slated for Die Life, the evolution and shift comes very much into focus.

[evalionisameme 13,900]

I actually prefer the production for the most part on ancient dreams than Froot… the drums hit a lot better-

Froot has some great work on it(title track in particular) but I’ve never been a massive fan 

 

 

[AllForYou 1,721]

10 minutes ago, evalionisameme said:

I actually prefer the production for the most part on ancient dreams than Froot… the drums hit a lot better-

Froot has some great work on it(title track in particular) but I’ve never been a massive fan

same! I think the mixing for FROOT is wrong for me, the demos are great

also what is everyone's opinions on Marina's name change? I see why she did it but I wish she went for 'marina diamandis' instead, it would be easier to search, I know people near the coast had a bit of difficulty getting tickets when they searched '[location] marina tickets'

also feels a bit rude for her to essentially trample on the other marinas spotify and apple music, she already had to change the logo once because it was similar to the other marina and I've never seen anyone talk about this:

I'm sure it's just a coincidence but you know what they say, imagery is artistic property, please respect your fellow artists.

[evalionisameme 13,900]

2 minutes ago, AllForYou said:

same! I think the mixing for FROOT is wrong for me

also what is everyone's opinions on Marina's name change? I see why she did it but I wish she went for 'marina diamandis' instead, it would be easier to search, I know people near the coast had a bit of difficulty getting tickets when they searched '[location] marina tickets'

also feels a bit rude for her to essentially trample on the other marinas spotify and apple music, she already had to change the logo once because it was similar to the other marina and I've never seen anyone talk about this:

I'm sure it's just a coincidence but you know what they say, imagery is artistic property, please respect your fellow artists.

I thought the name change was inane-why bother? Just go by Marina diamandis if you don’t want to be confused as a band.