Norman Fucking Rockwell - Post-Release Discussion Thread + Poll

[taco truck 32,992]

Literally everyone who is saying that isn’t the concept of the album or they “don’t see it” has said they don’t like the album😭😭 like obviously you aren’t spending the time to analyze and understand the songs on a deeper level if you don’t like the album 

[West Coast 45,795]

3 minutes ago, Mer said:

 

I think most songs are about the struggle of a young, modern day woman (with a "weak constitution") trying really really hard to create this perfect suburban life for herself and her partner(s), and continuously failing to do so and burning herself out in the process. So I can see both ways. As a criticism of the men around her, and of the picturesque version of domestic life she tries to conform to. 

 

But it has really an American thing? I'm not criticizing the album in itself, but I always fail to understand how people make this album to be some America-centric commentary. To me that's just modern day topics/struggles but in the context of her Cali experience.

[Crimson and Clover 22,505]

VB is so hot omg I wanna makeout with her

[Mer 61,772]

1 minute ago, West Coast said:

 

But it has really an American thing? I'm not criticizing the album in itself, but I always fail to understand how people make this album to be some America-centric commentary. To me that's just modern day topics/struggles. 

 

I mean, like I said, even the chosen title is deeply American-centric...but I think it can fit with most of the Western ideals.

[West Coast 45,795]

1 minute ago, Mer said:

 

I mean, like I said, even the chosen title is deeply American-centric...but I think it can fit with most of the Western ideals.

 

American title, but with Western ideals/topics. Got it. 👍

[Paris Hilton 9,873]

Venice Bitch so good had to ride it

[lanaismamom 11,544]

i Just like that we really got through the phase when u couldnt criticize nfr without called out to be seriously tasteless, literally the most annoying and unnecessary thing lana Stan could do

[Mer 61,772]

2 minutes ago, West Coast said:

 

American title, but with Western ideals/topics. Got it. 👍

 

Well...yeah? Not sure what you mean by this. Most of the Western world is very much defined and influenced by the US's ideals and lifestyles. Canada, US, and the UK all have a very similar cultural identity at their core, and so does Western Europe and Australia? Capitalism, individualism, nuclear-family, suburban-bliss...these things may have originated in the US, but they're pretty far reaching now. 

[West Coast 45,795]

35 minutes ago, Mer said:

 

Well...yeah? Not sure what you mean by this. Most of the Western world is very much defined and influenced by the US's ideals and lifestyles. Canada, US, and the UK all have a very similar cultural identity at their core, and so does Western Europe and Australia? Capitalism, individualism, nuclear-family, suburban-bliss...these things may have originated in the US, but they're pretty far reaching now. 

 

I get and agree with all of that, but my point still stands, NFR isn't this deep rooted American centric social commentary. Literally not getting that from the vast majority of its songs, besides the obvious titles/references.

[ultrabanisters 45,026]

why is this thread hot 

[Thats why they call me Dita 9,765]

Regardless of everything else.. NFR is just vibes, not sure how anybody can hate it 

[taco truck 32,992]

honestly i am so confused about this conversation because is lana's entire thing not americana?  like obviously her works incorporate american culture/ideals/politics lmao this was just the first album she explicitly stated that was the concept for the album.

[Cherry Blossom 21,539]

Venice bitch cut the tits out of her tank top so I did too.

[Future Jazz 9,194]

1 hour ago, taco truck said:

I’m walking to work right now so maybe I’ll explain it more later, but I think you’re confusing political commentary with social commentary. I would not consider the album political. But the album is very much a social commentary. I would consider “a modern day woman with a weak constitution” the thesis of this album. Like @PARADIXO said, it’s very much about the modern day LA citizen. And I agree, many of her albums do this, but it’s a few songs here and there, the most important thing though, is even if you personally do not sense that in your own analysis, it is the actual concept for the album, and why the album is titled “NFR” and why the cover has LA burning in flames .

but for me, as often with Lana, there is a major contrast between the concept of the album, which is called NFR for the reason you said, and its content which, imo, isn’t political or even social enough to justify the concept. i think that very often she extrapolates, takes things that characterize a few songs and applies them to the album as a whole, like when she said ultraviolence was almost unlistenable, or that many/most tracks on lfl were almost 6 minutes long, or that chemtrails was folky and guitar-based and so on.

so what i’m saying is that both the fans and the critics agreed to paint out this album to be a social commentary, and imo, there’s just not enough of it for this to be true, when you look at the lyrics. i could find many examples for lyrics on uv or hm that are just as social or relevant to society as “a modern-day woman with a weak constitution”. what this album is, however, is an album about herself and about her love stories, as 95% of the lyrics are solely about that, so that’s what i choose to see it as.

 

and i don’t think her metaphors or songwriting style makes it more characteristic of an educated person than her previous albums. maybe blue banisters and ocean blvd would, but again, even if there is hope is a dangerous thing, the rest of the album isn’t lyrically outstanding in comparison to her previous work

[wilting daisy 3,395]

1 hour ago, lanaismamom said:

i Just like that we really got through the phase when u couldnt criticize nfr without called out to be seriously tasteless, literally the most annoying and unnecessary thing lana Stan could do

what are you talking about? amongst lana fans, its just gotten to the point where we're finally allowed to love nfr without being accused of being a new fan or only liking things that are critically acclaimed. 

[PARADIXO 32,940]

1 hour ago, ultrabanisters said:

why is this thread hot 

 

cuz it's the nfr thread 

[Vertimus 9,557]

3 hours ago, taco truck said:

I’m walking to work right now so maybe I’ll explain it more later, but I think you’re confusing political commentary with social commentary. I would not consider the album political. But the album is very much a social commentary. I would consider “a modern day woman with a weak constitution” the thesis of this album. Like @PARADIXO said, it’s very much about the modern day LA citizen. And I agree, many of her albums do this, but it’s a few songs here and there, the most important thing though, is even if you personally do not sense that in your own analysis, it is the actual concept for the album, and why the album is titled “NFR” and why the cover has LA burning in flames .

I accept that may be the concept, but for me, if that is the concept, then it fails in its goal almost completely. What does 'Love Song' have to do with that? Or 'How To Disappear'? 

 

On the previous album, LFL , despite a few silly tracks, we had direct political commentary in 'WTWWAWWKOD' and subtler social, or social-political, commentary on 'Change,' 'God Bless AMERICA,' 'Heroin' and 'Get Free,' and references to many aspects of American life, past and present, on '13 Beaches,' 'Love,' 'White Mustang,' 'Summer Bummer,' 'Heroin,' and 'Tomorrow Never Came.' 

 

What happened with NFR! is that some influential internet critic said, "The entire album is a kind of metaphor for an America in decline," which she or he did not say, as it happens, about LFL, and that sounded really astute to a lot of people, who all began repeating it everywhere, until it became the general consensus whether it actually reflected the individual's own impressions of the album or not.

 

In this age of the internet, we see this happening again and again, this bandwagon-jumping, like "'Blue' is Joni Mitchell's masterpiece." People who don't know the first thing about Mitchell's 70s work will repeat that--and do repeat it---because it makes them feel in-the-know and part of a movement, however small in the scheme of things. And then, having repeated it a few times, they actually buy a copy and listen to it for the first time, and never bother with any of her other brilliant 70s work, besides which 'Blue' pales. 

 

It's fine to see it as the album of a "woman with a weak constitution," but she also had a weak constitution on '13 Beaches,' 'White Mustang,' 'The Blackest Day,' 'God Knows I Tried,' 'Swan Song,' 'Pretty When You Cry,' 'Ride,' and several from 'BTD.' 

 

Don't underestimate the power of 'group think' or 'the hive mind.' We see this every day in our own lives, like, someone asks you where you would like to go for dinner with the rest of the group, and you are the kind of person that immediately says, "Well, where does everyone else want to go? What are others thinking?"

 

It's just a very extroverted way of thinking, there's nothing wrong with it. 

[Vertimus 9,557]

2 hours ago, lanaismamom said:

i Just like that we really got through the phase when u couldnt criticize nfr without called out to be seriously tasteless, literally the most annoying and unnecessary thing lana Stan could do

It's ranking by an objective standard among her albums for Stans has gotten way, way out of control, and yes, I remember that era you speak of. I was there, here, in fact, on LB. It wasn't that long ago. 

 

I am glad so many people the world over enjoy NFR! it, which they obviously do. 

[GeminiLanaFan 49,044]

4 hours ago, Vertimus said:

But none of that is any different than what she did on all her earlier albums. 

On BTD, we also see a good picture of the times, where her relationships reflect many aspects of nowadays relationships. But not so much on UV or HM. LFL has those elements but they’re more in certain songs rather than sprinkled throughout the whole album. 
NFR was almost prophetic, with COVID embodied in both FIILY as « the rush », the « culture running though its own disaster »… ending with the greatest, which is « the death of the culture » like Jack and Lana said in interview. (Another brilliant aspect of this album is that, after the culture died on THE greatest, there’s almost a « restart » of the culture with simpler, piano-driven songs).

 

anyways, I love NFR and I know it’s not your cup of tea, which I totally respect. All I wanted to bring up was that critics probably love it more than some of her other LPs is because we see a larger scope of the time we live in. 

[taco truck 32,992]

4 minutes ago, GeminiLanaFan said:

On BTD, we also see a good picture of the times, where her relationships reflect many aspects of nowadays relationships. But not so much on UV or HM. LFL has those elements but they’re more in certain songs rather than sprinkled throughout the whole album. 
NFR was almost prophetic, with COVID embodied in both FIILY as « the rush », the « culture running though its own disaster »… ending with the greatest, which is « the death of the culture » like Jack and Lana said in interview. (Another brilliant aspect of this album is that, after the culture died on THE greatest, there’s almost a « restart » of the culture with simpler, piano-driven songs).

 

anyways, I love NFR and I know it’s not your cup of tea, which I totally respect. All I wanted to bring up was that critics probably love it more than some of her other LPs is because we see a larger scope of the time we live in. 

also political and social commentary are different, lfl was politcal and nfr was social.