Vertimus

This is true...he's publicly praised Parker Milsap, Foster The People, Lana, Billie and many others...even Kate Bush back when she was starting out...Parker Milsap says John called him and told him how great a vocalist John thought he was. He has nothing to prove to anyone, nor do I think he's trying to 'stay relevant' or glom attention off younger musicians. Even if the great era of his career was relatively short, for 5-7 years he made some of the greatest and most diverse rock music ever. And he sang about homosexuality at a time when it wasn't cool to do so, even if in what today would be considered a politically incorrect manner. As far as age differences between the listener and the artist, any person of any age can potentially appreciate any artist from any era. If that weren't true, how would younger people today appreciate Joni Mitchell's classic 70s era? Or John Coltrane? Or Ella Fitzgerald? Or even late 20s and 30s warblers like Annette Henshaw and Ruth Etting? Or the classic Rolling Stones, or Blondie, The Patti Smith Group, or Joy Division? The inverse is also true. Lana sings about human emotions and human experiences. Why should Elton not be able to relate directly to a song like 'Summertime Sadness,' 'Ride,' 'Old Money' or 'Wildflower Wildfire'? He's not dead yet. And he has a lifetime of memories to reflect upon. And we know Springsteen and Joan Baez love Lana's music, and Stevie Nicks to some degree, and Courtney Love. Among, probably, many other prominent artists and musicians.

I agree. She's doing what she wants to do as an artist, now more than ever, and that is her priority, period--and all that is on her mind. Clearly she doesn't care much about album graphics anymore, interviews, magazine covers, glamour, bright lights, red carpets.

No, it's not pointless, and I'm glad you responded. You're right: most of the world still expects an official, professional 'Pop rollout' a la Lady Gaga, Beyonce or Justin Bieber, with sexy/attractive photos, magazine covers, press coverage, interviews--just like LDR used to do, gracing the cover of Rolling Stone multiple times, giving long interviews, releasing an incredible number of photos of herself, being an international style icon for some 18 months, etc. So of us still expect that, or long for that, but COCC confirmed that those days are apparently over, at least for the time being, and by her own choice. The three new singles cover art supports that as well, as did the bland 'nothing' cover art for 'MAC' and 'VB' a few years back.

Late to the conversation, but though LDR is still technically a 'pop star,' I don't think she's released anything in the 'Pop' genre since Paradise, with 'Ride,' 'American' and 'Bel Air.' Pop is meant to be commercial; that's it's main purpose. 'Ultraviolence,' as released, was purposefully not Pop music, except, perhaps, for 'West Coast.' 'Honeymoon' was not a Pop album and really had no 'Pop radio-friendly' cuts except maybe 'Religion' and 'HBTB.' By this time, I was thinking of LDR as an Alternative artist (like Jeff Buckley or Tori Amos), though I still consider her musical genre to be 'Hollywood Sadcore' personally. As we know, the 'LFL' album was partially an attempt to produce a few pop radio-friendly tracks, including the title track, 'Love,' 'TNC,' and especially 'BPBP.' None received much radio play or were commercially successful as singles, which, to LDR and many of us, is neither here nor there. 'NFR!' was not a Pop album, but another album that was like 'Honeymoon' in that it continued her move away from Pop. 'COCC' has a Pop track: 'Wild At Heart,' but the rest is not Pop in any traditional sense, though some might consider 'DTWD,' 'NAWWAL' and 'TJF' to be Pop. The three singles just released from 'BB'/'RCS' are obviously not Pop. I don't think LDR wants to be known as a Pop artist, like Ariana Grande or the Jonas Brothers. That's been her whole point since 'UV.' I don't think when Bruce Springsteen, who continues to rave about her public, thinks of her he thinks of LDR as a Pop artist, and Joan Baez probably doesn't either, nor Stevie or Courtney. They, more than anyone, can understand her desire to change, evolve and grow, and being taken seriously as a musician.

100% agree. 'Art For Art's Sake,' like the MGM logo claims as the lion roars. 'Everything is political' is true only if the individual in question sees, and chooses to see, everything as political. LDR should be free to do as she pleases. That would be a genuine act of revenge against the bolsheviks that have cropped up everywhere. Let them rage, let them howl, let them stress themselves into an early grave. That's their problem, their choice. As far as 'disturbing art' goes, Lana's released a bit of that, like 'Gods & Monsters,' 'Ultraviolence,' 'Money Power Glory,' 'Heroin' and 'The Greatest'......her vision of the end of the world and 'life on Mars' is fairly powerful. But her most disturbing track is the officially unreleased 'Live or Die,' in which she and her thuggish boyfriend travel around shooting random individuals while a chorus of cheerleader-like 'Heyyyyyys! erupt in the background. To me, it's one of her very best. Part of being an artist is looking into the darkness.

At this point, it's hard not to believe she does it on purpose or with extreme carelessness. The medical community unfortunately targets two related groups of people, with two related 'personality disorders,' with not learning from their mistakes, ever. For us, since we do know about this absurd habit of hers, there's nothing to do but expect and accept it, or stop stanning LDR.

That part is in-CRED-ible. The best part of the three songs for me.

That is absolutely true. We know she can't say anything, or do almost anything, without being attacked. We can't even discuss, honestly and responsibly, some of what she's said without being attacked here. We know verbal communication is not her strongpoint, unless she's really comfortable with herself at the moment, in control, and comfortable with the person interviewing her, like Courtney Love. Symbolic and relative 'radio silence' is best for her at this point, at least for the time being, and until the media finds another 'perfect,' seemingly 'unwoke' punching bag (sadly enough). She doesn't see to be enjoying stardom anymore--"but I'm not a star!"--it's a full-time job for those who really want it above all else, and above their artistry (if any)--and many artists have left "the star-making machinery" behind, including Joni Mitchell, Nico, Laura Nyro, Prince and Axl Rose. In a few years, it could be Tyler Joseph, Justin Bieber or Beyonce that wants to live privately or reclusively. Stardom means having to endlessly live up to some sort of public ideal and having 0 privacy--among others unpleasant issues, like stalkers and break-ins.

The Ignore User function is your friend, believe me. It gives you back power and control over your experience here.

There's been plenty of bullying here, loads, in fact, since I've been a member. Really nasty attacks. I don't know if there was in this particular case--some said there was--but I'm saying that the moderators should not allow or tolerate any. Members should be banned for bullying or attempted bullying. Thankfully, we can all use the Ignore function to block those who do. My Ignore list is as long as my arm.

No bullying should ever be allowed here.

Grenadine isn't even spelled correctly.

If the revenge is against her mother and, to a lesser degree, her father, it does.

Can we assume that Sean is/was a racist? That seems like a huge leap. Why would he be attending a BLM rally with her if he was? Also, look at the way she refers to Old Man River, as if it's a cafe, restaurant or bar, and, indeed, there is an Old Man River bar in Los Angeles. So they were, in the song, at a BLM protest near or outside of the Old Man River bar. Obviously, due to the history of the words 'Old Man River,' we know there's a double meaning to them being used. On the contrary, I think she and Sean were happy in that moment, perhaps also with other friends, and she wishes she could also have been with her father, or that he could have joined them, because she was proud of herself and Sean, and at that moment, Sean saw who she was in a positive way. But they've since broken up, as the song makes clear, and so 'old man river keeps rolling, with or without him,' meaning Sean, and, as a father figure, by extension, her father.

You are too kind. Many thanks.

I do think both TB and WW do represent an 'advance' in her songwriting and artistry, just as 'HIADT' and 'Yosemite' did. They really show more of what she's capable of. And, additionally, TB and WW are more like her poetry than HIADT, at least to me. It's as if she attempted to meld her poems to actual melodies and music, instead of using 'atmospheric' background music. And she really succeeded. BB, is, for me, more like HIADT--it's a creative success, but not necessarily something I want on repeat. Now, whether Stans, fans or critics want an album of WWs and TBs is another matter, or whether Stans want to see her continue in this inward-turning, 'private mythology' direction. Clearly, many of us love these new songs, and, more importantly, relate to them. Many musicans in the recent past and relatively distant past have done the same thing over time---Nico, Joni Mitchell, Leonard Cohen, Laura Nyro, Neil Young, Bruce Springsteen, Tori Amos, Fiona Apple, Jeff Buckley, Twenty One Pilots and many more. They more or less leave their main or initial fanbase behind. Some, like Rayland Baxter, go the opposite route--from deep, touching and meaningful songs to pure 'sell out' fluff.

I think 'Serene Queen,' cut from LFL as we know, had a vibe that was both 'futuristic'/techno-ish and 'witchy.' It's one of my favorite leaked tracks.

Thanks, GLF. Since it was produced by Mike Dean, I was thinking it might have been recorded once with Jack for COCC, and then a second, perhaps slightly different, version was recorded with Mike. Time will tell. Maybe 'dealing' or 'the deal' is a motif of the album.

Thanks. If so, then the 'Dealer' title makes perfect sense. She's dealing out the deep tea at last to someone she loves.

So: do we think 'WW' is a revamped or renamed 'Dealer'? Of course, she stresses the word 'deal' four times, and she did say, last year or in late 2019, that, to paraphrase, she 'did a lot of screaming' on 'Dealer,' and WW does end with that very powerful screeching. I'd more than happy if it is 'Dealer' with a new title. I do think it would have fit very well on COCC, a nice balance to 'WD' and 'Yosemite.'

Don't forget she's said she's writing one, in the process of doing so. Tori Amos badly derailed her career by her 7-year commitment to her own theatrical piece, 'The Light Princess,' which in the end turned out to be a creative and commercial flop.I hope LDR doesn't slide down that rabbit hole. Edit: Sorry. I see someone posted the same point.

I agree. There's absolutely nothing, wrong with honest, even hard, criticism. Cultish 'IT'S LANA FOR GOD'S SAKE!' feeling (it can't be called thinking), does no one any good, including the artist. I've seen it with so many musicians, from Bob Dylan, Tori Amos and Jeff Buckley to Twenty-One Pilots and beyond.

Well, I disagree. Some of the intonations are very close to hers. It's so distorted I don't think anyone can really say.

To me, 'Under My Skin' does sound like LDR and the words are sung the way she often does. Full release/leak, please.

Perhaps--perhaps--the 'revenge' was meant to be directed against her parents? TB and WW present a fairly bad, if very likely honest, portrayal of her parents within certain limited contexts. I'm still wondering 'if the issue of her' refers to her mother, thus presenting a tight Electra-complex scenario--"I'm in love with my father and hate my competition for him, my mother.' It's possible. Or it could just be another woman the police boyfriend and father-stand in was interested in and became a wedge between them. Tori Amos has written, in 'Bliss' especially a very graphic and direct attack on her father or 'father image,' father archetype. It's full of incest references. She says, "he wants into mine" and refers to his "supernova juice." As a song, it went right over the heads of 99% of her Stans. Releasing it seems to have freed her from her father complex and rage against 'the patriarchy.' Father I killed my monkey I let it out to taste the sweet of spring Wonder if I will wander out Test my tether to see if I'm still free from you Steady as it comes right down to you I've said it all So maybe we're a bliss of another kind I said A bliss of another kind I said Lately I'm in to circuitry What it means to be Made of you but not enough of you And I wonder if you can bilocate Is that what I taste Your supernova juice? You know it's true I'm a part of you Steady as it comes right down to you I've said it all So maybe we're a bliss of another kind I said Steady as it comes right down to you I've said it all So maybe you're a four horse engine with a power drive I said A hot kachina who wants into mine I said Take it, take it with your terra- terra- terracide And I said steady as it comes right down to you I've said it all So maybe we're a bliss of another kind I said A bliss of another kind I said A bliss of another kind I said