AllForYou

I thought exactly the same.
I think with l+f we were expecting 'why' she was missing so long, some angst and explanation in her music (which is in some outtakes like demons + angels) but she came around with 'enjoy your life! :)' which was disingenuous, and we all knew it, including her. adiaml feels more honest but her writing still isn't up to par, though that's more evident on the political tracks rather than personal ones imo.
I'm not sure she can ever get to MATD levels again but I'd rather be pleasantly surprised rather than let down, she writes best when she's writing from specific* personal experiences or has a theme (adiaml title track springs to mind, and obviously electra heart). (*she admitted she didn't do this for l+f, she wrote 'generally' and why I think her cover of 'only want you' from the era feels like it could have been on the album)
I agree with you, I actually wrote a bit more in my original post but deleted it because it felt too long. but in short, my opinion is to get around the accusations that you're only coming out to 'sell' something is you either make the product good, and therefore it doesn't need selling, or you form a parasocial relationship to sell the product, marina isn't doing either and that's where she's been falling short.
there are successful artists that don't interact with their fanbases at all and just drop music and hide away again, but I think if you didn't start that way it's quite difficult to make the transition, you almost have to make the music twice as good to make up for the lack of interaction, which again, she hasn't been doing and I can't see her doing. (as much as I would like her to bring out a 10/10 album and would be happy to be proven wrong.)

I thought exactly the same.
I think with l+f we were expecting 'why' she was missing so long, some angst and explanation in her music (which is in some outtakes like demons + angels) but she came around with 'enjoy your life! :)' which was disingenuous, and we all knew it, including her. adiaml feels more honest but her writing still isn't up to par, though that's more evident on the political tracks rather than personal ones imo.
I'm not sure she can ever get to MATD levels again but I'd rather be pleasantly surprised rather than let down, she writes best when she's writing from specific* personal experiences or has a theme (adiaml title track springs to mind, and obviously electra heart). (*she admitted she didn't do this for l+f, she wrote 'generally' and why I think her cover of 'only want you' from the era feels like it could have been on the album)
I agree with you, I actually wrote a bit more in my original post but deleted it because it felt too long. but in short, my opinion is to get around the accusations that you're only coming out to 'sell' something is you either make the product good, and therefore it doesn't need selling, or you form a parasocial relationship to sell the product, marina isn't doing either and that's where she's been falling short.
there are successful artists that don't interact with their fanbases at all and just drop music and hide away again, but I think if you didn't start that way it's quite difficult to make the transition, you almost have to make the music twice as good to make up for the lack of interaction, which again, she hasn't been doing and I can't see her doing. (as much as I would like her to bring out a 10/10 album and would be happy to be proven wrong.)

wait this is actually hilarious 

Charli doesn't have any worse albums but if anything: SUCKER is a least favorite as it's not much of an authentic record tho I can still enjoy it. Like she hates Break The Rules and Boom Clap (even tho it kinda fits) wasn't meant for the album originally. SUCKER was intended to be more commercial. True Romance is one of her best but no one is ready for that conversation. Crash is also cute but its underwhelming imo, Idk how to explain it. But anyway I dont rank stuff personally bc i dont like the idea of having this best to worst list (cba to explain it i just woke up) but my top 3 is BRAT (and the remix album), True Romance and Pop 2.

Not this True Romance slander- get out of here 

It really isn’t but someone always has to be quirky and different ig 

I thought exactly the same.
I think with l+f we were expecting 'why' she was missing so long, some angst and explanation in her music (which is in some outtakes like demons + angels) but she came around with 'enjoy your life! :)' which was disingenuous, and we all knew it, including her. adiaml feels more honest but her writing still isn't up to par, though that's more evident on the political tracks rather than personal ones imo.
I'm not sure she can ever get to MATD levels again but I'd rather be pleasantly surprised rather than let down, she writes best when she's writing from specific* personal experiences or has a theme (adiaml title track springs to mind, and obviously electra heart). (*she admitted she didn't do this for l+f, she wrote 'generally' and why I think her cover of 'only want you' from the era feels like it could have been on the album)
I agree with you, I actually wrote a bit more in my original post but deleted it because it felt too long. but in short, my opinion is to get around the accusations that you're only coming out to 'sell' something is you either make the product good, and therefore it doesn't need selling, or you form a parasocial relationship to sell the product, marina isn't doing either and that's where she's been falling short.
there are successful artists that don't interact with their fanbases at all and just drop music and hide away again, but I think if you didn't start that way it's quite difficult to make the transition, you almost have to make the music twice as good to make up for the lack of interaction, which again, she hasn't been doing and I can't see her doing. (as much as I would like her to bring out a 10/10 album and would be happy to be proven wrong.)

so the poetry book came out in some (but not all?) countries yesterday so both the ebook and the audiobook have been 'leaked'.
initially I just read the ebook, I didn't find the experience of reading the ebook to particularly be enjoyable as, unsurprisingly, I found the linebreaks to disrupt the flow. I would say only about 20% of the poems (the ones she's already previewed) were formatted 'artistically', with the other 80% formatted more like beautiful/evil.
this being said, she still used line breaks in strange places, this is really apparent when you listen to her read the audiobook and also have the book open to read along to, she doesn't follow the line breaks the majority of the time. I think the most egregious example of bad formatting is probably eat the world itself. for some poems there were some instances where she had a sentence over three lines, but as the style was two lines to a paragraph, the third line would paired with an irrelevant next sentence start from the next paragraph.
grievances over, and maybe controversially, I do think some of the 'artistic' formatting was quite fun when used deliberately and sparingly, like how she formatted 'down' in the sparkling clam
overall the audiobook was a much better experience and I enjoyed listening to it, though it isn't set to music. I do hope she puts production behind her audio and puts them on streaming, as all the poems come across much better in her own voice even the 'badly written' ones we've previously dragged discussed.
as for the actual contents, it reads as personal and clearly about things she wanted to get off her chest, though I wasn't 'shocked' by anything she said. I did find some of the poems very relatable, but others might not. there was only one other music related 'lore' drop, like aspartame relating to hollywood, in 'smoothness of money,' she talks about the posh boyfriend that was embarrassed of her (seventeen). I wish there was more, but all the poems other than those two are written about things since she's been in LA, with the exception to school of life, where she says jack upset her in the car after her speech in 2019.

Interacting with your fans is not the only way to grow a fan base, most artists do by simply making good music. Madonna managed to keep her fanbase engaged for 50 years and all it took was making good music.
 
i feel like we are giving Marina too much leeway, she is absolutely 100% at fault for the wreck that is her career 

I thought exactly the same.
I think with l+f we were expecting 'why' she was missing so long, some angst and explanation in her music (which is in some outtakes like demons + angels) but she came around with 'enjoy your life! :)' which was disingenuous, and we all knew it, including her. adiaml feels more honest but her writing still isn't up to par, though that's more evident on the political tracks rather than personal ones imo.
I'm not sure she can ever get to MATD levels again but I'd rather be pleasantly surprised rather than let down, she writes best when she's writing from specific* personal experiences or has a theme (adiaml title track springs to mind, and obviously electra heart). (*she admitted she didn't do this for l+f, she wrote 'generally' and why I think her cover of 'only want you' from the era feels like it could have been on the album)
I agree with you, I actually wrote a bit more in my original post but deleted it because it felt too long. but in short, my opinion is to get around the accusations that you're only coming out to 'sell' something is you either make the product good, and therefore it doesn't need selling, or you form a parasocial relationship to sell the product, marina isn't doing either and that's where she's been falling short.
there are successful artists that don't interact with their fanbases at all and just drop music and hide away again, but I think if you didn't start that way it's quite difficult to make the transition, you almost have to make the music twice as good to make up for the lack of interaction, which again, she hasn't been doing and I can't see her doing. (as much as I would like her to bring out a 10/10 album and would be happy to be proven wrong.)

That's also probably a big part of it. I forget she's that old. In the TFJ-EH-Froot run I always think of her as being like, 19 to 24, when in reality she was like 25 to 30.

I think that might be a part of some of the fanbase's 'disconnect'. I feel like there was a HUGE leap in perceived maturity - between Froot and L+F it felt like she somehow lurched forward a decade in her appearance and appearances, mannerisms, attitude, etc. I always imagine EH, specifically, being such a 18-21 year old's album. The themes and the touches of angst around it are just so..... "youthful" to me. And then Froot comes along and we glow up a bit, but then....it feels like there was a missing "step" between that and L+F, and that "missing step" in maturity in all forms I think is where things rifted.
 
All rambles but I hope someone gets what I'm trying to put down.

I think it's this OCD-like thing but it's just so satisfying to see when an artist's discography are all albums with no million EPs or mixtapes and no stand-alone singles and collabs  It's weird I know but I just had to say this because I still haven't found an artist with a discography like that lol

the greatest success of froot was that she had created fanbase that genuinely cared about her and was excited for her going 'indie' and finding happiness that she dedicated the record for.

yes the diamonds were supposed to be her fans, whilst 111 was right and she’s said things like ‘no I don’t love you, I don’t know you’ she has, in the MATD era at least, been very vocal about how grateful she is to her fans as she wouldn’t be able to do what she does without the support of them. especially in the FROOT era as the success of the album was due to the fanbase, it’s why it’s still held in such high regard, and imo why some fans are missing that ‘hit’ of recognition now.
 
the truth is I don’t think we’ll ever get MATD levels of interaction again because she’s not in her 20s anymore. it’s not that 39 year olds can’t be ‘with it’ but I think she’s made it clear she doesn’t want to be ‘with it’/on social media anymore. (and as she’s blocking teenagers for mild reviews of her poetry that’s probably for the best)

I’m not sure why she (or her team) didn’t think to make the event shorter if she didn’t actually have anything to say for 2hrs, if it was an hour and she stayed even 10 minutes longer with some faux ‘omg I really have to go but you guys are great’ everyone would be hyping her up right now. yes parasocial relationships in this current age are going too far, but you have to foster them a bit or people ‘notice’ they’re being sold something. after all it’s not regular poetry readers are buying her book, it’s her fans. 
___

in other news she said the album is finishing production so I’m wondering about the schedule. I don’t think we’ll get a single this year as it’s cutting it a bit fine, but she has the 10 year anniversary of FROOT in March so will she release a single, promote that then jump back to m6? seems a bit messy but it would be on brand. 

yes the diamonds were supposed to be her fans, whilst 111 was right and she’s said things like ‘no I don’t love you, I don’t know you’ she has, in the MATD era at least, been very vocal about how grateful she is to her fans as she wouldn’t be able to do what she does without the support of them. especially in the FROOT era as the success of the album was due to the fanbase, it’s why it’s still held in such high regard, and imo why some fans are missing that ‘hit’ of recognition now.
 
the truth is I don’t think we’ll ever get MATD levels of interaction again because she’s not in her 20s anymore. it’s not that 39 year olds can’t be ‘with it’ but I think she’s made it clear she doesn’t want to be ‘with it’/on social media anymore. (and as she’s blocking teenagers for mild reviews of her poetry that’s probably for the best)

I’m not sure why she (or her team) didn’t think to make the event shorter if she didn’t actually have anything to say for 2hrs, if it was an hour and she stayed even 10 minutes longer with some faux ‘omg I really have to go but you guys are great’ everyone would be hyping her up right now. yes parasocial relationships in this current age are going too far, but you have to foster them a bit or people ‘notice’ they’re being sold something. after all it’s not regular poetry readers are buying her book, it’s her fans. 
___

in other news she said the album is finishing production so I’m wondering about the schedule. I don’t think we’ll get a single this year as it’s cutting it a bit fine, but she has the 10 year anniversary of FROOT in March so will she release a single, promote that then jump back to m6? seems a bit messy but it would be on brand. 

it seems like marina's been channelling sky ferreira and arriving 10m late and leaving 30m early on her book tour, she also blocked a fan on instagram for posting a slightly negative review (reddit thread)
I think it's fair enough that marina might want questions unrelated to music but then the questions should've been pre-screened (maybe a questionnaire before the event then asked by the host?), but most fans would have bought it on the day of the event with their ticket so I'm not sure how anyone was supposed to ask poetry related questions anyway

"and the Diamonds" IIRC was supposed to represent her fans too, right?
 
So we've got that being punted, then I guess "I can't love my fans b/c I don't know them" - which we've seen from other artists, and saying that is kicking a proverbial hornets nest with how parasocial fans are nowadays like logically I get it but if you say that people lose their shit.

Then a little book tour divaism?

Why does it give me a vibe like she's just on autopilot about it all? Like she's just making music/art for a paycheck and not so much a passion? 

I actually really liked the poetry book. As some of you may know, I was not a fan of the Zine she did during ADIAML. (lol).
I dont read poetry so that might be why, I have no bar to set it against. I didnt really like Lana's book, I struggled to get through it but I did love the audio book and own a couple of the records.
My personal favourites after the first read:
 
I really enjoy her perspective on life and it mirrors a lot of what I've gone through, especially over the last 8 years. Some of the line breaks were a little weird but it doesnt personally bother me that much. I love the artwork throughout the book.
I'm not a huge fan of the theme of Love in art because there are so many other topics to explore it just gets old for me, so obviously those poems didnt resonate as much. Just my personal opinion though, obviously a lot of people enjoy that.
I'm surprised its getting such a negative response tbh. The poetry is exactly what I expected.

I really feel like people build female artists up just to tear them down

shocked charli got so many noms actually (not in a bad way but it took a global movement to finally get our girl taken seriously)

honestly her reaction seemed a little strange to me (clip for those who haven’t seen it) but maybe it’s a case of being overwhelmed by all those people in person wanting the song vs people typing in her comments?
 
if I were her I would have said ‘I have something special planned for FROOT’s anniversary’ as she’s alluded to it being on there already. I feel like people are going to assume she’s changed her mind again when it’s not on Spotify in the next few weeks.

is anyone surprised... she's always been this way with her fans lol. she had many live streams talking about how she doesn't "love" her fans because how can she love people she doesn't know (which is valid ig but not how you treat people who pays your LA house mortgage) 
 
this is why her career will never see the tumblr days, even if she continued making mid music a strong fanbase would have kept her afloat but she lacks that connection with her fans 

so the poetry book came out in some (but not all?) countries yesterday so both the ebook and the audiobook have been 'leaked'.
initially I just read the ebook, I didn't find the experience of reading the ebook to particularly be enjoyable as, unsurprisingly, I found the linebreaks to disrupt the flow. I would say only about 20% of the poems (the ones she's already previewed) were formatted 'artistically', with the other 80% formatted more like beautiful/evil.
this being said, she still used line breaks in strange places, this is really apparent when you listen to her read the audiobook and also have the book open to read along to, she doesn't follow the line breaks the majority of the time. I think the most egregious example of bad formatting is probably eat the world itself. for some poems there were some instances where she had a sentence over three lines, but as the style was two lines to a paragraph, the third line would paired with an irrelevant next sentence start from the next paragraph.
grievances over, and maybe controversially, I do think some of the 'artistic' formatting was quite fun when used deliberately and sparingly, like how she formatted 'down' in the sparkling clam
overall the audiobook was a much better experience and I enjoyed listening to it, though it isn't set to music. I do hope she puts production behind her audio and puts them on streaming, as all the poems come across much better in her own voice even the 'badly written' ones we've previously dragged discussed.
as for the actual contents, it reads as personal and clearly about things she wanted to get off her chest, though I wasn't 'shocked' by anything she said. I did find some of the poems very relatable, but others might not. there was only one other music related 'lore' drop, like aspartame relating to hollywood, in 'smoothness of money,' she talks about the posh boyfriend that was embarrassed of her (seventeen). I wish there was more, but all the poems other than those two are written about things since she's been in LA, with the exception to school of life, where she says jack upset her in the car after her speech in 2019.

honestly that was about all the information in the poem lol, it's written in this 'stream of consciousness' style which she struggled to read, however I think it is very effective at conveying that upset/panic attack moment when you want to say what's wrong and it comes out as gibberish. she's reposted people sharing her poems on her instagram stories so I don't think she minds them being posted, they're also on the wiki if you want to see all of them, these are the ones I think are about jack.
school of life (this was just before the album came out in early april 2019, but the actual speech wasn't recorded so there are only some clips by people that were there)
million tiny cuts
out of production
marie kondo
 

This is going down in my person hall of fame-

 
THANK YOU LOVE!! I’m never getting over it