"The Gay Cure"

[Sitar 22,213]

I am unlocking bc HDB has continued the discussion.

 

Keep it the fuck cute

[Viva 3,169]

let me just say a little something. What about people who feel oppressed by their sexuality? Are they not human? shouldnt be able to deal with it?

 

Did you read the post? Because if you didn't is useless to talk about the issue. This is almost a law which basically means that the STATE is STATING that being gay is a disease. They are not offering medical treatment so gays or bi's or the one in between can feel good about themselves. They are offering  psychological treatment because they are stating that being gay is a disease.

[Wryta Thinkpiece 3,344]

You are absolutely wrong. Please read this article on the subject (which has the full report linked within, not summarized like the link I provided). Also, as a general rule of common courtesy, everyone should make sure they know exactly what they are talking about when subjects as fragile as this are brought up - to avoid arguments like the one above. If you're not careful then you can potentially offend a lot of people. At least have some kind of source to prove your point, so that you don't come across as a brute to others. 

 

Sorry if other mods think my response is unwarranted. I'm just a bit upset by the entire argument and I wanted to educate people as best I could because it's a sensitive topic to me as well as many others. 

I was going to post the same article, along with a video, before the topic got locked. Thank you, Hundred.

 

Guys, just be wary about how you articulate your opinions. It's not about what's being discussed, as sexuality is a very intricate and interesting topic, and I have had the pleasure of discussing and sharing many different angles of it with many different people. I even came to learn of many sexualities and ways of emotional intimacy that I never even knew possible. This can be a wonderful topic, but regardless of your stance, you have to watch how you're voicing your opinion.

 

I endured some very painful emotional blows on a weekly basis for two years because my brother could not wrap his mind around the concept of sexuality and discuss it maturely, often telling me I needed the same "treatment" as this committee is condoning, labeling me "ill" and "dysfunctional." And maybe it was just me, but I couldn't handle getting treated like that by my brother the same way I could when I got that treatment from my peers after I came out (because, frankly, once I stopped giving a fuck my Freshman year, so did everyone else as far as bullying me went.) I resorted to harming myself as a catharsis exercise to cope with the heartache and grief that hindered me from living my teenage years a little more fully. At twenty-one, I go to therapy (NOT REPARATIVE THERAPY) and visit my doctor monthly, and I'll tell you one thing: My sexuality has not been addressed as an issue by either, the only issue being addressed was that people still viewed it as an issue despite the development of science and society proving otherwise.

 

Needless to say, how this discussion got handled was a bit triggering, and so my point of sharing that painful (and irrelevant-to-a-degree) moment in my life is to remind current partakers/future partakers of this discussion that you are going to be engaging in a very fragile topic and your words will turn into daggers and fists if you do not think about what you are going to say. If you're not going to be careful with how you voice your opinion, and you're not going to back it up with recent sources that support your claim as much as you support it as a fact, then this may not be the topic for you. There are many other people on LB who may have had some rough patches in their life, and things like this can be very triggering if handled incorrectly. It is very easy to be feckless with your words when you don't think about what damage you could do to someone who hears or reads them.

 

BUT NOW BACK ON TOPIC.

Reparative therapy to "treat" sexuality does not work because sexuality is not a distortion and it is not an illness; it is wired into your DNA like the amount of certain melanin in your eyes and hair. So as an analogy, you could wear colored contacts or bleach/dye your hair to change what it naturally is, but it doesn't change that these things are not of you. They are manipulations of your image, and reparative therapy does the same exact manipulation to your emotional well-being. Every day you are coming home to yourself with a self-loathing that is the product of the "therapy," the ongoing "treatment" that "keeps you from turning gay/lesbian/bisexual/etc. again." I am a major in psychology and reparative therapy is considered one of the most dangerous and fruitless "forms of therapy" if not a complete mockery of therapy in general. There have been very few cases of a post-reparative therapy patient actually living a happier life, if not no cases at all. It is a dangerous thing, and I question the integrity of any psychologist/psychiatrist who practices and utilizes that form of therapy knowing fully well how damaging it truly is.

 

http://www.hrc.org/resources/entry/the-lies-and-dangers-of-reparative-therapy

 

http://www.splcenter.org/conversion-therapy

 

http://community.pflag.org/page.aspx?pid=503

 

God knows how many times I had done research all throughout high school and for my psych courses, so I am more than prepared to give more sources.

 

[Divisive Princess 3,754]

I'd like to give my opinion as a religious person. First of all, I am NOT here to shove my religion down anyone's throats or say that you're wrong for loving who you love. That being said, I honestly don't think there's a cure for homosexuality. You are who you are and that's just the way it is. I don't think people choose to be gay don't think there's treatment that can help. From a religious stance, (and I know some of you are probably groaning because talking about religion isn't exactly everyone's choice of conversation, and I know; I try to avoid it with my mom at all costs, but I just feel like people are categorizing religious people and religion as something that it's not as far as homosexuality goes) I think that God made everyone exactly how he wanted them. He created everyone to love one another. Although the Bible says people of the same gender are not to lie together, (first of all that's a very general statement; I daresay not specific enough to be actually talking about gay people, but who knows) he created you just how he wanted you. And another misconception is that God hates gay people, and that I know for a fact is false because he doesn't hate anyone. (Which his followers who call themselves Christians should have that mentality, too. Just sayin'.) 

 

In a nutshell, even though I'm a Christian, I see nothing wrong with homosexuality and I don't think that people should be so quick to pin most of the homophobia on religious people. 

 

P.S- If anyone disagrees with me, that's fine. I don't even care if you say you disagree because I don't mind having a conversation about it. Just don't be mean. And don't slander me for my religion. I'm not here to start an argument, I just wanted to clear the air surrounding some misconceptions about Christians themselves. So....yeah.

[jess9715 156]

@ I like the way you stated your views as a Christian as I too am religious. I feel the same way that you do and feel that Christians as a group are stereotypicalized as hating homosexuals which I say is not true for much of us.

 

 I myself am straight. Homosexuality is definitely a rough topic for my family as my uncle was homosexual and died of AIDS. This occured during a time when AIDS was thought to be a disease of only homosexuals. Because of this, my uncle was persecuted severely by my family and died alone. This happened before I was born and no one talks about it to this day. I do not agree with this type of treatment at all and think that being gay does not change you as a person. I see no differences between someone who is straight and someone who is gay besides sexual orientation. This should definitely not be treated as a disease. Everyone is equal in my eyes and those of many other Christians I know. God loves all people.  :) 

[Viva 3,169]

I'd like to give my opinion as a religious person. First of all, I am NOT here to shove my religion down anyone's throats or say that you're wrong for loving who you love. That being said, I honestly don't think there's a cure for homosexuality. You are who you are and that's just the way it is. I don't think people choose to be gay don't think there's treatment that can help. From a religious stance, (and I know some of you are probably groaning because talking about religion isn't exactly everyone's choice of conversation, and I know; I try to avoid it with my mom at all costs, but I just feel like people are categorizing religious people and religion as something that it's not as far as homosexuality goes) I think that God made everyone exactly how he wanted them. He created everyone to love one another. Although the Bible says people of the same gender are not to lie together, (first of all that's a very general statement; I daresay not specific enough to be actually talking about gay people, but who knows) he created you just how he wanted you. And another misconception is that God hates gay people, and that I know for a fact is false because he doesn't hate anyone. (Which his followers who call themselves Christians should have that mentality, too. Just sayin'.) 

 

In a nutshell, even though I'm a Christian, I see nothing wrong with homosexuality and I don't think that people should be so quick to pin most of the homophobia on religious people. 

 

P.S- If anyone disagrees with me, that's fine. I don't even care if you say you disagree because I don't mind having a conversation about it. Just don't be mean. And don't slander me for my religion. I'm not here to start an argument, I just wanted to clear the air surrounding some misconceptions about Christians themselves. So....yeah.

 

See now that I can honestly respect.I am not gay or bi or lost in between but as someone who really sees a absolute HUGEEEEE difference between the church denying gay marriage or rights or whatever and the STATE doing so I respect your view a lot. If I think like you? No I dont but I can understand and respect that thought .

 

ps: what do you think about the church denying gay marriage? do you think is this type of thought that is making the catholic church obsolete?

[ExoticFlower 892]

yeah, albinos are found in every species. are they something normal? no. Its not something pathologic its something mental and it is NOT normal. 

 

You may say you're not against homosexuality, but the way you call it abnormal and almost talk about it like it's something that needs to be "fixed" is kind of offensive. You should voice your opinions differently, because I know for a fact that there are a lot of gay men (and women?) on this forum. Which makes me happy, because gay or straight, we all need a little bit of Lana in our life.

 

And remember.

 

[VegasBaby 895]

You should voice your opinions differently, because I know for a fact that there are a lot of gay men (and women?) on this forum.

A lot of hetero men don't seem to mind lesbians but kick up a huge fuss about gay men..That really annoys me.

[evilentity 13,345]

Probably the most well-known "reparative therapy" organization in the US recently admitted it's bullshit, doesn't work, and does a lot of harm. They issued apologies and shut down. 

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/06/20/exodus-international-shuts-down_n_3470911.html

[Velvet Elvis 223]

Did you read the post? Because if you didn't is useless to talk about the issue. This is almost a law which basically means that the STATE is STATING that being gay is a disease. They are not offering medical treatment so gays or bi's or the one in between can feel good about themselves. They are offering  psychological treatment because they are stating that being gay is a disease.

Yeas! I dont support this "law" cause this shouldnt be a law. But people who need to get help about their sexuality should be able to get psychological support or shouldnt they just because people that feel proud about being homosexual consider that offensive. Plus, its not a normal behaviour ~IM NOT SAYING IT IS WRONG~ do you know how the human mind works have you ever read about how sexuality forms? People are propelled to the other sex for a reason. 

 

You may say you're not against homosexuality, but the way you call it abnormal and almost talk about it like it's something that needs to be "fixed" is kind of offensive. You should voice your opinions differently, because I know for a fact that there are a lot of gay men (and women?) on this forum. Which makes me happy, because gay or straight, we all need a little bit of Lana in our life.

 

And remember.

 

Why do you keep telling things(not talking specifically about you) that I never stated. I dont think it should be fixed. People should feel special about who and what they are. Its a good thing to feel special. And please dont turn the subject on me. Quote me again if and only if you have an argument on the actual subject,

[Velvet Elvis 223]

You are absolutely wrong. Please read this article on the subject (which has the full report linked within, not summarized like the link I provided). Also, as a general rule of common courtesy, everyone should make sure they know exactly what they are talking about when subjects as fragile as this are brought up - to avoid arguments like the one above. If you're not careful then you can potentially offend a lot of people. At least have some kind of source to prove your point, so that you don't come across as a brute to others. 

 

Sorry if other mods think my response is unwarranted. I'm just a bit upset by the entire argument and I wanted to educate people as best I could because it's a sensitive topic to me as well as many others. 

Its not about genetics its about the personality itself and how IT is formed. my source is Sigmund Freud. "The anal stage, in Freudian psychology, is the period of human development occurring at about one to three years of age. Around this age, the child begins to toilet train, which brings about the child's fascination in the erogenous zone of the anus. The erogenous zone is focused on the bowel and bladder control. Therefore, Freud believed that the libido was mainly focused on controlling the bladder and bowel movements. The anal stage coincides with the start of the child’s ability to control their anal sphincter, and therefore their ability to give or withhold gifts at will. If the children during this stage can overcome the conflict it will result in a sense of accomplishment and independence." please read the phallic stage as well http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phallic_stage. its not something youre born with (of course there are exceptions when hormones are not normal), it forms at the age when you begin to realise pleasure. So do you think it happens by luck that most people are straight? Its not about society and the standars it has put though its a serious factor but its also about the instincts, about the way our body was made.

[evilentity 13,345]

^ Seriously? You're citing Freud on this?

Look, if you mean it's "not normal" in the sense that being left-handed is "not normal" then I agree with you and this is just a silly semantic argument and you should just choose your words more carefully. But if you mean something more than that, then I think you're not only wrong, but you're being offensive.

[lola 6,641]

Its not about genetics its about the personality itself and how IT is formed. my source is Sigmund Freud. "The anal stage, in Freudian psychology, is the period of human development occurring at about one to three years of age. Around this age, the child begins to toilet train, which brings about the child's fascination in the erogenous zone of the anus. The erogenous zone is focused on the bowel and bladder control. Therefore, Freud believed that the libido was mainly focused on controlling the bladder and bowel movements. The anal stage coincides with the start of the child’s ability to control their anal sphincter, and therefore their ability to give or withhold gifts at will. If the children during this stage can overcome the conflict it will result in a sense of accomplishment and independence." please read the phallic stage as well http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phallic_stage. its not something youre born with (of course there are exceptions when hormones are not normal), it forms at the age when you begin to realise pleasure. So do you think it happens by luck that most people are straight? Its not about society and the standars it has put though its a serious factor but its also about the instincts, about the way our body was made.

you know that article says nothing about homosexuality? "They will form into an adult who hates mess, is obsessively tidy, punctual, and respectful to authority. These adults can sometimes be stubborn and be very careful over their money. They will also be inconsiderate of others feelings."

 

and are you saying anal sex is wrong?   

[Jessica Fletcher 6]

[Velvet Elvis 223]

you know that article says nothing about homosexuality? "They will form into an adult who hates mess, is obsessively tidy, punctual, and respectful to authority. These adults can sometimes be stubborn and be very careful over their money. They will also be inconsiderate of others feelings."

 

and are you saying anal sex is wrong?   

so, homosexuality has nothing to do with sexuality? cause it talks about the way sexuality is formed. Are you asking my personal opinion on anal?

[Viva 3,169]

Its not about genetics its about the personality itself and how IT is formed. my source is Sigmund Freud. "The anal stage, in Freudian psychology, is the period of human development occurring at about one to three years of age. Around this age, the child begins to toilet train, which brings about the child's fascination in the erogenous zone of the anus. The erogenous zone is focused on the bowel and bladder control. Therefore, Freud believed that the libido was mainly focused on controlling the bladder and bowel movements. The anal stage coincides with the start of the child’s ability to control their anal sphincter, and therefore their ability to give or withhold gifts at will. If the children during this stage can overcome the conflict it will result in a sense of accomplishment and independence." please read the phallic stage as well http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phallic_stage. its not something youre born with (of course there are exceptions when hormones are not normal), it forms at the age when you begin to realise pleasure. So do you think it happens by luck that most people are straight? Its not about society and the standars it has put though its a serious factor but its also about the instincts, about the way our body was made.

 

Look at what you said. You contradict yourself:

a)  its not something youre born with.

b) Its not about society and the standars it has put though its a serious factor but its also about the instincts, about the way our body was made.

 

If is about your instincts, about the way your body was made and formed than is fair to say is about GENETICS right? So if is a genetic formation is not really a choice.

 

And even if was a choice (which I now it ISN'T) why should be considered a bad choice or something people are not allowed to be or do? Even if you believe that is a choice there is nothing wrong with that choice.

 

Freud can be interpreted in many ways. Freud can only be responsible for what he wrote the way you read it your interpretation that is YOUR responsability. Transforming or adjusting his words so you can justify your thoughts is on you not on Freud because I see that quote as a little part of very long explanation tha at ANY point says that being gay is a choice.

 

Maybe you are not comfortable with your own sexuality which is ok because many people I know are not comfortable too. Maybe you are from a small town and telling you how I see it or the others here see it like something completely normal and honestly mundane is not fair. Maybe people around you never really supported ones choice of who to love or the freedom to be the way they are. I don't now your background there for I am going to gang up on you.

 

But I will tell you one thing : Imo the way you think today will only make your world small. Will reduce it to books, texts of psychiatrists. There are many gay boys here maybe you should PM them and talk to them. I am pretty sure that most will gladly talk to you about their own experiences. Not books or old Freud but real people of flash and blood that live, talk and walk that walk.

[Velvet Elvis 223]

Look at what you said. You contradict yourself:

a)  its not something youre born with.

b) Its not about society and the standars it has put though its a serious factor but its also about the instincts, about the way our body was made.

 

If is about your instincts, about the way your body was made and formed than is fair to say is about GENETICS right? So if is a genetic formation is not really a choice.

 

And even if was a choice (which I now it ISN'T) why should be considered a bad choice or something people are not allowed to be or do? Even if you believe that is a choice there is nothing wrong with that choice.

 

Freud can be interpreted in many ways. Freud can only be responsible for what he wrote the way you read it your interpretation that is YOUR responsability. Transforming or adjusting his words so you can justify your thoughts is on you not on Freud because I see that quote as a little part of very long explanation tha at ANY point says that being gay is a choice.

 

Maybe you are not comfortable with your own sexuality which is ok because many people I know are not comfortable too. Maybe you are from a small town and telling you how I see it or the others here see it like something completely normal and honestly mundane is not fair. Maybe people around you never really supported ones choice of who to love or the freedom to be the way they are. I don't now your background there for I am going to gang up on you.

 

But I will tell you one thing : Imo the way you think today will only make your world small. Will reduce it to books, texts of psychiatrists. There are many gay boys here maybe you should PM them and talk to them. I am pretty sure that most will gladly talk to you about their own experiences. Not books or old Freud but real people of flash and blood that live, talk and walk that walk.

I dont think I ever talked personally about you so please dont offend me. You didnt understand something and maybe I should have been more clear.

a)  its not something youre born with. reffers to homosexuality

b) Its not about society and the standars it has put though its a serious factor but its also about the instincts, about the way our body was made. reffers to heterosexuality

 

There is no interpretation, what Freud has stated is clear and the books that I have read about him state that, maybe you just cant realise what he is talking about from a small part of his words but that is nott my fault. please dont add populism to this by reffering to me. whatever you have to say it should consider the subject.(otherwise Im not gonna answer, which may be good thing if you just want to talk about me, but irrelevant)

[Viva 3,169]

I dont think I ever talked personally about you so please dont offend me. You didnt understand something and maybe I should have been more clear.

a)  its not something youre born with. reffers to homosexuality

b) Its not about society and the standars it has put though its a serious factor but its also about the instincts, about the way our body was made. reffers to heterosexuality

 

There is no interpretation, what Freud has stated is clear and the books that I have read about him state that, maybe you just cant realise what he is talking about from a small part of his words but that is nott my fault. please dont add populism to this by reffering to me. whatever you have to say it should consider the subject.(otherwise Im not gonna answer, which may be good thing if you just want to talk about me, but irrelevant)

 

I CAN WRITE PRETTY BIG BEAUTY QUEEN STYLE TOO LOL

 

AND I DO UNDERSTAND WHAT FREUD SAYS BUT YOU DONT SEEM TO UNDERSTAND NOT ONLY WHAT FREUD SAYS BUT ALSO THE MEANING OF THE WORD/TERM POPULISM SINCE WHAT I WROTE HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE POLITICAL MOVEMENT THAT IS POPULISM

 

Populism is a political philosophy where adherents claim that they side with "the people" against "the elites". While for much of the twentieth century, populism was considered to be a political phenomenon mostly of Latin America and India, since the 1980s populist movements and parties have enjoyed degrees of success in First World democracies such as the United States of America, Canada, Italy, the Netherlands, and Scandinavian countries.

[Velvet Elvis 223]

I CAN WRITE PRETTY BIG BEAUTY QUEEN STYLE TOO LOL

 

AND I DO UNDERSTAND WHAT FREUD SAYS BUT YOU DONT SEEM TO UNDERSTAND NOT ONLY WHAT FREUD SAYS BUT ALSO THE MEANING OF THE WORD/TERM POPULISM SINCE WHAT I WROTE HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE POLITICAL MOVEMENT THAT IS POPULISM

 

Populism is a political philosophy where adherents claim that they side with "the people" against "the elites". While for much of the twentieth century, populism was considered to be a political phenomenon mostly of Latin America and India, since the 1980s populist movements and parties have enjoyed degrees of success in First World democracies such as the United States of America, Canada, Italy, the Netherlands, and Scandinavian countries.

no arguments on the actual subject. thats great. since populism is a latin word trust me I know how to use it. You just googled it right? Antonia22 this is METAPHOR! hey METAPHOR this is ANTONIA22. have a little chat together. Im sorry but this is ridiculous. stop talking about things that dont reffer to the actual subject. (seriously now, big beauty queen style? Good one )

[Viva 3,169]

no arguments on the actual subject. thats great. since populism is a latin word trust me I know how to use it. You just googled it right? Antonia22 this is METAPHOR! hey METAPHOR this is ANTONIA22. have a little chat together. Im sorry but this is ridiculous. stop talking about things that dont reffer to the actual subject. (seriously now, big beauty queen style? Good one )

 

googled the meaning? I just pasted because was easyer since I obviously now what it is LOL...I am Brazilian and populism is one of the many reasons my country is in a riot almost a revolution. So not only I do know the meaning but I also do now your anology/methafor makes no sense what so ever just like the rest of your thoughts. How can one argue or talk with you when you are unable to be at least civil? Look I answered it very niceeeee to you first not now. Not gonna make a mess out of this thread. The reason I created this thread was to really hear others thoughts since this is something that is actually happening over here.  Thats all.  You are entitled to your own thoughts and is not going to be me to pick a fight over this.