Vertimus

I believe that because, in the stanza above, she's just said "I guess you could call it textbook, I was looking for the father I wanted back," and whom she thought she had finally found in Brentwood (in Sean?). But just as she's currently still haunted by longing for her father or the father archetype, she's also haunted, in 'textbook' style, by her mother, or the mother image and archetype, whom she had to compete with for her father's love and attention. Perhaps she's now seeing her 'mother' again in someone new, someone who is coming between her and the new man in her life--a member here said it could be Sean's daughter, which it could be, if Lana perceived the daughter as doing exactly what she perceived mother had done--come between her and her father in her childhood and youth. It happens. This is all classic Freudian 'family romance.' So in a way, she's blaming all or some her adult life romantic problems on her mother, "on the issue of her," and, as we know, she doesn't have a good relationship with her mother, which she's (also) addressed on WFWF and again on OC.

Yes, very much.

Full agree. Why Lana apparently chose the entire production to come off so 'dim' and muffled is beyond me, especially on the vocals. It makes the whole album feel sleepy and distant. To me it sounds as if she were singing on the other side of the room from the mic during the whole time in the studio. And that goes for the music too. Crisp, clear, direct, it is not. I agree about the AirPods too, even the most current model. And that's why this thread died, IMO. It's not because of the early leaks, it's because the album is not exactly vibrant. To use Chaotic Lipster's phrase, I don't think the replay value is strong the way it is on many other of Lana's albums, that we've literally been listening to years and haven't tired of.

I've always thought her was Lana's mother, who she had to compete with for Rob's attention. It's classic Electra Complex---textbook--stuff.

Thanks. I like that. I live by logic.

Can you characterize @graham4anything a little for me? I don't recall that member.

Are you being serious? I hope not. It's an observation. And I don't recall you ever speaking that way about your reaction to a LDR song, though you may have.

I think we have to acknowledge--there could be an entire thread about this--that apparently something like more than 50% of Lana stans live, right now, on a day-to-day basis at a very emotional level, ready to cry tears of anger, deep sadness, grief, rage, depression, frustration, hopelessness, etc., at almost any moment, as members here often report. Not being of this frame of mind or heart, it really jumps out at me on LBs. The high percentage does surprise me at times. We know most of us tend to relate to Lana on an emotional level as well as an artistic one---if we didn't like her music artistically, we wouldn't care about it or want an emotional relationship to it---and her catalog is generally very satisfying in this way, including leaked tracks like 'If I Die Young.' I, too, would like more "trashy bops." I wouldn't mind if she made an entire album of songs like 'Making Out' and 'Meet Me in the Pale Moonlight,' or the original 'Live or Die,' in fact, I think I'd prefer it to another generally sleepy album like OC. But it doesn't seem that that is what most here want, based on the strong emotional reactions to 'Fingertips' especially, but also 'Candy Necklace,' 'The Grants,' 'A&W,' 'Grandfather' and 'Kintsugi. On the other hand, almost everyone loved 'VB' on NFR! and it's certainly not a overly-emotional track.

I still love BB the album and haven't tired of it in the least, a year and a half or so on, though I tend to skip the leaked tracks, which I've known for years. For me, BB is better than COCC, which I also like and haven't tired of, and much better than NFR! And for me, BB is better than OB too, though I recognize that with OB Lana was trying something different on some of the tracks, 'broke the mold,' and went out on a limb creatively, which I appreciate. But I find myself already bored with it--if the songs come on while I'm shuffling through almost 10,000 songs, I play them, but I don't seek the album to play. And I prefer the clear vocal production on the new BB tracks to the more distant sound on OC.

Right. It's not as if she says, states, or speaks out loud for anyone to hear every decision she makes. We know she changes her mind all the time. Any creative person knows--especially writers of any kind--that it's a fluid process, and there are all kinds of sudden new ideas, inspiration, or whims, alterations, and reversals. I'll say it again: if they had 'Madonna Studies' in some colleges and universities in the 80s, there should be 'LDR Studies' now, because an entire lengthy book could be written about what is known factually about her, what is speculation, and what is completely unknown about her and her recordings--the unknown has to be acknowledged as such, especially when, now, we're suddenly finding out information and getting complete files of songs about which we formerly knew nothing.

Because we Americans foolishly give them power, instead of saying, "try seeing the glass half full," or even "tough shit, that's your problem," or "No one cares." It's one thing for a person to have a genuine grievance based on a rational argument, and another for a person, or, a group, to go around constantly looking for things to find "offensive" or "insulting" because they get attention and some degree of momentary power.

A PULSE.

Another great, passionate song gutted and made bland.

She'll have become a new member of The Grants.

So we already have new Lana music to look forward to, even though we don't yet know what her contribution will be. Maybe she'll just be humming in the background. I liked his first single release and look forward to the second.

I understand this completely. Some/most of OC sounds like it was made predominantly for Lana and her family. I was listening to ‘Cult Leader,’ ‘Dragon Slayer,’ ‘Unidentified Flying Bill,’ and ‘French Restaurant’ earlier today, and had to admit to myself that I enjoyed all of them more than than I enjoy all the OC tracks except ‘LTLI.’

Well, they do Stan her. Most are hardline feminists, and some are maniacal about her; they enshrine her, they fall just short of worshipping her. They see her as a potent, all-powerful symbol of the mistreatment and systemic abuse of women in the 20th century.

I accept it as it is, but would much prefer that the VB part only came after, if at all, the a second or third verse. Right when it really starts to heat up, it turns into a version of VB.

70+ years. Like I said earlier, there is, and has been for decades, Elizabeth Short 'stans' to fiercely protect her memory across the internet. There's an army of them and they're angry and partisan. They don't care for the facts any more than any other person or group. So Lana may come in for some emotional violence in the days or weeks ahead. ALSO, in 'A&W,' Lana wrote how if she were raped, she would be blamed for it, it would have "been her fault," so that should show the Shorties that Lana's perspective is very likely not that Elizabeth Short brought her own doom down upon her head by her behavior. The murder has become a part of American history and lore, and belongs to everyone and no one.

Exactly. There's no such thing. Everyone's taste is a fact in itself--it's a fact that we all have opinions that we call our 'taste,' there's no such thing as an objectively good movie, song, album, artist, painting, piece of architecture, decor, etc.

Agreed. We have to wait and see what results. I'm a little surprised she selected CN to make a video for, out of all the OB songs.

Yes, I referred to George Hodel, he was the doctor I mentioned whose own child suspected him and his friends, including Man Ray, of the murder, but there's been several books in which children come forward with the shocking news that they believe their father was the BD murderer, and none of the books are taken very seriously. That's becoming a sub-genre of the Short industry--claiming that your father was the Black Dahlia murderer. In the book about G. Hodel, the photo that the daughter claims is Short, and puts forward as 'evidence' that her father knew and killed Short, clearly isn't Short. It's just a pale, slightly Asian-appearing woman with an oval face and her hair done up in what looks almost like a geisha style.

Thank you--apparently I saw everything else on IG but that. As to why some may be mad about it, I've followed the case for years, read most of the books about the BD murder, and, from my online contacts, learned that there is a fairly massive number of people, mostly women, mostly feminists, who either identify with Short, or don't want to see her memory further sullied, or both. But you can read 15 books on the topic and get 15 completely different sets of 'facts' and interpretation of those 'facts' about Short, so at this point it's like reading about the Jack the Ripper murders: very few authors are objective, honest, and rely on the hard facts that are actually known. Political, social, and subjective views flood the interpretations; some feminists perceive male authors and investigators as slandering Short when they feel she should be treated like a saint due to her victimhood, while some authors feel that the hard facts about Short's life have to be brought to light. But no one can decide on what the facts are, short of the autopsy report.

Okay--if that's accurate, then Lord knows what we're in for. I don't know if we can assume it will be 'tasteful' or tactful, or respectful of Short's memory and 'all-over-the-place' reputation. As I mentioned yesterday, Short has a legion of devoted guardians, and they're quick to attack anyone who dares to sully, or further sully, her reputation. So I would expect they will come after Lana now, unless Lana approaches her as a victim of a male-dominated society. It seems as if everyone who knew Short had a completely different impression of her, and books have even been published by friends who knew her back in New England. That Short may have lied a great deal would be no surprise, that's often the case with young people trying to rise through society or an industry in a strange town, while simultaneously trying make ends meet.

Apparently, the video Lana is producing for 'Candy Necklace,' or has already produced, features her in 1940s style, in terms of hair and dress, and she has a large purple or purplish flower in her hair, which was the social trademark of Elizabeth Short, a young woman who came to Hollywood seeking fame, may or may not have gotten into a lot of trouble with the wrong people, and ended up murdered by party or parties still unknown, her remains tossed in a field in Hollywood, completely severed at the waist and with her mouth slit from ear to ear. As you can imagine, it shocked the late 1940s genteel America, which was starting to enjoy the post-war boom. Everything is available on google, though I don't know if the gruesomest photos still are. Beware. Endless books have been written about Short, making all kinds of wild statements and conjectures--that she fell into prostitution, that she was never a prostitute, that she had no vaginal canal or uterus (this is not mentioned in the autopsy, so I think it can be ruled out), that she was pregnant at the time of her death, that she used people relentlessly to survive (for example, once she slept on your sofa once and you fed her, you could never get her to leave), that she was the nicest person imaginable, that she was lazy and preferred to live off people and go from person to person, that her teeth were in terrible shape (that's putting it mildly), that she affected white facial powder and dyed her hair black, that she was publicly promiscuous (she would go down on men in bars, it was reported), etc. Numerous people, all men to my knowledge, including doctors, policemen, underworld figures (Bugsy Siegel), and famous people have been suspected and investigated as being her murderer. It's one of the most high-profile unsolved cases of the 20th century. Whether Lana is actually using Short and her murder as a theme for the 'CN' video, I don't know. I could certainly see it, as 'CN' is doom-laden. When Lana released the footage on IG over the last 48 hours, the internet erupted with the idea that she's drawing on the Black Dahlia murder for the video. Whether there's any hard evidence of that, I don't know. Does anyone? Has she or Ben said anything to that effect? She mentions suicide on the album more than once, on more than one song.