kik

As much as we'll miss your condescension and having someone around to give us moral guidance, I have to farewell you with the traditional 'don't let the door hit your ass on the way out'. If you don't want to offend people, maybe you should not rush to call someone you've never met a 'whore'. English is obviously not your first language, so you might not pick up on some of the subtlety behind what Lana is saying, but it's not her fault that you're ignorant.
 
Have fun sticking to morally pure artists, and I hope your wife never reads what you think about her body.

Did she ever mention a little escape to the great sunshine with a
 
 
 
 
... and that his wife wouldn't mind?

Same look
 

Cults are so fascinating, I'm not surprised she was inspired to write about it since she has an interest in codependency. To know how involved she was, probably not much, if not at all lol!
 
There are different types of cults and some are very hardcore and some are more "respectable" organizations, like Raëlian movement, but honestly, I would avoid them all like the plague. Gurus master the art of manipulation, they are going to brainwash you to eventually totally control you (financially, sexually, psychologically...)
 
I saw a movie about it twelve years ago and I immediately bought the book of an ex member of the sect who told her story. It was a great read, but very disturbing. I didn't care much about the gore, but I wanted to know WHY these members would not leave the sect. Here's some info I found on wiki that explain how powerful these gurus are. Don't read if you are sensitive:
 
Thériault was a charismatic leader[citation needed] and none of the other members questioned his judgment or blamed him for any physical, mental or emotional damage.[3] The Ant Hill Kids raised money for living by selling baked goods[7] and members who didn’t bring in enough money were severely punished. Thériault spied on his members, making sure everybody was completely devoted and punishing those who strayed, claiming that God told him what they did.
 
His punishments were extreme. If a person wanted to leave the commune, Thériault would punish them with either belts, hits from a hammer, suspending them from the ceiling, plucking each of their body hairs individually, or even by defecating on them.[8]
 
Despite his devastating punishments, the members of the Ant Hill Kids never questioned his authority. His punishments included making members break their own legs with sledgehammers, sitting on lit stoves, shooting each other in the shoulders, and eating dead mice and feces. A follower would sometimes be asked to cut off another follower's toes with wire cutters to prove loyalty. The children were not spared, and not only were they sexually abused, but they were also at times held over fires or would be nailed to trees while other children threw stones at them. Thériault was also responsible for the death of his own infant, as he left the child outside during a blizzard.
 
Going back to the original mission of the commune, Thériault strongly believed in purifying his subordinates. He would rid them of their sins through purification sessions where the members would be completely nude as he whipped and beat them. Claiming to be a holy being, Thériault demonstrated his healing powers through surgeries performed on sick members. He would sometimes inject 94% ethanol solution into followers' stomachs, or perform circumcisions on the children and adults of the group.[4]
 
When follower Solange Boilard complained of an upset stomach, Thériault laid her naked on a table, punched her in the stomach, jammed a plastic tube up her rectum to perform a crude enema with molasses and olive oil, then cut open her abdomen, and ripped off part of her intestines with his bare hands. Thériault made another member, Gabrielle Lavallée, stitch her up using needle and thread, and had the other women shove a tube down her throat and blow.[9] Boilard died the next day. Claiming to have power of resurrection, Thériault bore a hole into Boilard's skull with a drill, and then made other male members—along with himself—ejaculate into the cavity.[4]
 
Gabrielle Lavallée underwent harsh treatment herself during the years leading up to 1989. She had suffered through welding torches on her genitals, a hypodermic needle breaking off in her back and even eight of her teeth being forcibly removed.[8] Upon her return, after having escaped from the commune, Thériault removed one of her fingers with wire cutters, pinned her hand to a wooden table with a hunting knife and then amputated her entire arm. The abuse that caused Gabrielle Lavallée to leave, however, is when Thériault cut off parts of her breast and smashed her head in with the blunt side of an ax. She fled and contacted authorities. The cult shut down in 1989, when Thériault was arrested and given a life sentence.[4]
 
Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roch_Th%C3%A9riault
 
WTF, I read that text again and it's so violent it's hard to believe it really happened... Even after he was sentenced, some of his very faithful wives came to visit him at jail and they had more children as they were allowed to use the trailers (federal jails here allow convicts to use them temporarily to meet their significant other with more privacy). That's crazy. How blind can one be.
 
Thériault was found dead near his cell, February 26, 2011, at Dorchester Penitentiary, in New Brunswick. He was 63 years old. His death is believed to be the result of an altercation with his cell mate, Matthew Gerrard MacDonald, 60, of Port au Port, N.L, who killed Thériault and has been charged with the killing.[12][13][14] MacDonald pled guilty to second degree murder and was sentenced to life in prison (having already been serving a life sentence for a previous murder charge). MacDonald stabbed Thériault in the neck with a homemade knife. Afterwards, he walked to the guards' station, handed them the knife and proclaimed, "That piece of shit is down on the range. Here's the knife, I've sliced him up."
 
Jeez...

Lana's polyamory (if that is the right word... I think she has used the word "polygamy" but that doesn't seem to fit either) has been making me uncomfortable for awhile now -- but also opening my eyes to what it must be like for people who openly defy conventional mores. And frankly, some conventional mores need defying.
 
I say this as someone who wishes there was more room in our culture for both women and men who wish to pursue celibacy before marriage. I grew up in purity culture; I was raised to see "girls who do" as something Other, and my parents even questioned whether a close female friend of mine was "a good person" upon finding out she was sexually active. I am ashamed to admit I bought into it long enough to wonder how I would relate to my own daughter if she grew up to be someone "believing in sex before marriage."
 
THIS is cultural insanity. THIS is what is mentally unbalanced: pitting "good girls" against "bad girls," friends against friends, even mothers against daughters. This is what should outrage us: shaming women (regardless of their choices) for being embodied as sexual beings, shaming men (and women) for being attracted to them as sexual beings, and passing on plenty of sexual hang-ups to our daughters AND our sons, whether they are people who "do" or "don't."
 
The double standard doesn't work for us anymore, if it ever did. And attempting the pseudo-egalitarian solution of slut-shaming men as well as women doesn't cut it either. The world is becoming more complicated (culturally... sexually... ) and maybe that scares some people. But maybe this is an opportunity to find other ways of encouraging each other to be more loving, respectful, honorable human beings instead of resorting to the implication "just be more like me so I can feel better about you as well as myself." Many of us are not buying it anymore, and for that I am grateful. For my daughter's sake, and for the sake of other people's sons and daughters, I am grateful.
 
LDR is not alone in portraying female sexual empowerment; as others have pointed out, artists like Miley Cyrus are creating space for women to be fully embodied as themselves (for better or worse -- it is possible to see both, and still welcome the greater space). Lana is just more overtly analytical about it. I say we need her voice, even if I personally disagree with hers sometimes. I hope she doesn't suffer remorse for it. I hope she realizes she is on the front lines of something big -- even if she didn't ask for the confrontation, I hope she decides that being true to herself is worth it.

Did she ever mention a little escape to the great sunshine with a
 
 
 
 
... and that his wife wouldn't mind?

I look up to liberated women who have sex with whomever they want. It is ok. I could never do it coz I am so repressed.
Sexuality is not a dirty thing, it is beautiful. It comes from God. Religion really messed with people's heads making them feel unnaturally sinful. Nothing wrong with a good sweaty fuck if it is not illegal.
Jesus... A woman can screw around and still be a good person, daughter, citizen, whatever.
I can't believe this sexism... I only worry about Lana getting emotionally involved with a jerk and getting hurt.
Hope she gets all the action she needs and is fully satisfied and appreciated as a woman. Get it baby!! Write us more sexy songs.

Barrie heartbreak is no excuse for those trousers.
 
 
Excited to hear the album though <3

Oh what can I do? To turn you on or get through to you..... 

You're right, it's not like she sings about a 'burning desire,' or being fucked 'hard in the pouring rain,' or actually depicts having sex on a pinball machine or anything overtly sexual in her art 
... Oh wait...

Did she ever mention a little escape to the great sunshine with a
 
 
 
 
... and that his wife wouldn't mind?

Did she ever mention a little escape to the great sunshine with a
 
 
 
 
... and that his wife wouldn't mind?

@@bloodredjam, I do find a lot of what you posted intriguing and thought-provoking, but I don't feel any differently towards Lana/Lizzy regarding the things she has stated this time around. 
 
A lot of people have sex just for fun, to try and feel something besides numbness, to assuage loneliness etc.  It doesn't mean they are using others or that they don't have good home lives.  As you said prior, these types of actions can arise from mental illness- or they cannot.  Doesn't really matter.  It's no reason to dislike Lana, unless you adhere to a strict morality.
 
I personally don't understand people who can do this, but I don't judge them.  I think they must be missing something and they're looking for it.  That's all.
 
I do enjoy armchair diagnosing people and, especially in the cases of celebrities, they make it too easy sometimes.  I dont find it disrespectful to do this as long as it's not judgment of their characters and instead genuine curiousity.

Cults are so fascinating, I'm not surprised she was inspired to write about it since she has an interest in codependency. To know how involved she was, probably not much, if not at all lol!
 
There are different types of cults and some are very hardcore and some are more "respectable" organizations, like Raëlian movement, but honestly, I would avoid them all like the plague. Gurus master the art of manipulation, they are going to brainwash you to eventually totally control you (financially, sexually, psychologically...)
 
I saw a movie about it twelve years ago and I immediately bought the book of an ex member of the sect who told her story. It was a great read, but very disturbing. I didn't care much about the gore, but I wanted to know WHY these members would not leave the sect. Here's some info I found on wiki that explain how powerful these gurus are. Don't read if you are sensitive:
 
Thériault was a charismatic leader[citation needed] and none of the other members questioned his judgment or blamed him for any physical, mental or emotional damage.[3] The Ant Hill Kids raised money for living by selling baked goods[7] and members who didn’t bring in enough money were severely punished. Thériault spied on his members, making sure everybody was completely devoted and punishing those who strayed, claiming that God told him what they did.
 
His punishments were extreme. If a person wanted to leave the commune, Thériault would punish them with either belts, hits from a hammer, suspending them from the ceiling, plucking each of their body hairs individually, or even by defecating on them.[8]
 
Despite his devastating punishments, the members of the Ant Hill Kids never questioned his authority. His punishments included making members break their own legs with sledgehammers, sitting on lit stoves, shooting each other in the shoulders, and eating dead mice and feces. A follower would sometimes be asked to cut off another follower's toes with wire cutters to prove loyalty. The children were not spared, and not only were they sexually abused, but they were also at times held over fires or would be nailed to trees while other children threw stones at them. Thériault was also responsible for the death of his own infant, as he left the child outside during a blizzard.
 
Going back to the original mission of the commune, Thériault strongly believed in purifying his subordinates. He would rid them of their sins through purification sessions where the members would be completely nude as he whipped and beat them. Claiming to be a holy being, Thériault demonstrated his healing powers through surgeries performed on sick members. He would sometimes inject 94% ethanol solution into followers' stomachs, or perform circumcisions on the children and adults of the group.[4]
 
When follower Solange Boilard complained of an upset stomach, Thériault laid her naked on a table, punched her in the stomach, jammed a plastic tube up her rectum to perform a crude enema with molasses and olive oil, then cut open her abdomen, and ripped off part of her intestines with his bare hands. Thériault made another member, Gabrielle Lavallée, stitch her up using needle and thread, and had the other women shove a tube down her throat and blow.[9] Boilard died the next day. Claiming to have power of resurrection, Thériault bore a hole into Boilard's skull with a drill, and then made other male members—along with himself—ejaculate into the cavity.[4]
 
Gabrielle Lavallée underwent harsh treatment herself during the years leading up to 1989. She had suffered through welding torches on her genitals, a hypodermic needle breaking off in her back and even eight of her teeth being forcibly removed.[8] Upon her return, after having escaped from the commune, Thériault removed one of her fingers with wire cutters, pinned her hand to a wooden table with a hunting knife and then amputated her entire arm. The abuse that caused Gabrielle Lavallée to leave, however, is when Thériault cut off parts of her breast and smashed her head in with the blunt side of an ax. She fled and contacted authorities. The cult shut down in 1989, when Thériault was arrested and given a life sentence.[4]
 
Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roch_Th%C3%A9riault
 
WTF, I read that text again and it's so violent it's hard to believe it really happened... Even after he was sentenced, some of his very faithful wives came to visit him at jail and they had more children as they were allowed to use the trailers (federal jails here allow convicts to use them temporarily to meet their significant other with more privacy). That's crazy. How blind can one be.
 
Thériault was found dead near his cell, February 26, 2011, at Dorchester Penitentiary, in New Brunswick. He was 63 years old. His death is believed to be the result of an altercation with his cell mate, Matthew Gerrard MacDonald, 60, of Port au Port, N.L, who killed Thériault and has been charged with the killing.[12][13][14] MacDonald pled guilty to second degree murder and was sentenced to life in prison (having already been serving a life sentence for a previous murder charge). MacDonald stabbed Thériault in the neck with a homemade knife. Afterwards, he walked to the guards' station, handed them the knife and proclaimed, "That piece of shit is down on the range. Here's the knife, I've sliced him up."
 
Jeez...

Sigh. The powers of clairvoyance that some people on this board possess is astounding sometimes. I would have thought we were past the point where sexual behaviour wasn't seen as conflicting with loving being around your family, but apparently we've still got a long way to go, baby. 
 
Here is an alternative explanation for some of the behaviour that doesn't require pretending to have some insight into the mental processes of somebody who you've never met. 
 
Singing, writing, performing, dancing, public relations, mixing with people, taking criticism and being optimistic are all different characteristics or skills. A person can have a few, or all, or none of these, but having one doesn't necessarily mean that you would be expected to have any of the others. To be a pop star, though, you're meant to have all of them, to an extreme degree. Each of us will decide which of them is more important - some people don't think a person should be considered a singer if they can't perform live, others don't care as long as they sound good on record. Some of us don't want to see a singer who can't dance at the same time, others of us don't care. Some of us don't care who a singer treats her fans, others of us really care about how the performer relates to people who like her. But you cannot ascribe a mental iilness to somebody because they are missing a few of these attributes. 
 
Even if Lizzy always wanted to be successful, the fact that there are parts of fame that make her miserable don't make her a hypocrite. They just mean that she couldn't see the future (like most of us can't), and the things that she was looking for in being famous came with a higher price than she expected. It's an age old story, and the only artists who manage to get through it are the ones who find a way to ignore all of the bullshit and focus entirely on the creative process. The rest either burn out or overdose or freak out. I'm hoping that the shift in tone in reporting on Lana - from beautiful puppet to worthwhile songwriter and singer - helps her to make the transition, but at this point, anything can happen. 
 
The Beatles stopped performing live because they couldn't hear themselves on stage, and because nobody cared about what they sounded like. Maybe Lana will decide that the chance to see the smiles on the people in the front row is not worth all of the bullshit, and she'll stop singing live as well. It's 100% true that some of her songs live are better than others, and some of her shows are better than others, and she has a few decisions to make about performing. But from her perspective, the things that she enjoyed doing - that were her way into the industry - had nothing to do with standing in front of 50,000 fans. They were writing, singing and putting together videos, and all of them could be done in a small room with only a few people around. That's an attitude I can relate to.
 
Finally, relationships fall apart for all sorts of reasons, and there is no such thing as the objective truth of why something fucks up. Everybody who has an opinion is either a biased participant, or someone who doesn't know what happened. So when it comes to her time with Barrie and what went wrong, the only reasonable response is to nod and move on, and accept what both of them say about it as their take on it.