Ohio School Shooter Laughing at Victims Families

[TrailerParkDarling 5,691]

Since you don't believe in the death penalty, what about torturing? That sounds really wicked....but if hes not gonna die......where exactly is the justice? Our taxes pay for his life? Im not exactly comfortable with providing a "nice enough" place for a prisoner. I suppose he will be either killed or beat in prison though. 

 

No offense, but it drives me crazy when people talk about "taxes" and the death penalty.. look up how much the death penalty costs and how much it costs to house a prisoner for life..the latter is substantially less.  

 

Torturing violates 8th amendment cruel & unusual punishment- death, of course, does as well but the U.S. overlooks that..matter of convenience when it comes to staying faithful to the BOR. 

 

Justice comes in the form of a life term- he'll never have a family of his own, he'll never travel, etc. His life is over. Read up on max security prisons- it isn't a cakewalk.  Hell on earth and not good for a young boy like him (the term 'fish' comes to mind)  (btw, not saying he shouldn't be in prison cos his sentence was 100% appropriate imo)

[xNoirx 657]

I don't really know anything about this case but on the topic of the death penalty, I'm definitely against it. I do not agree that the state should have control over whether or not they end this man's life. I do however believe that he should rot in prison, literally. My personal opinion is that murderers,rapists and anyone who commits a crime that could be given a death penalty sentence should be put in a room alone with their thoughts, with only basic food and little to no communication to people outside that room. They should be alone so their thoughts eat away at them until they die. They shouldn't be allowed to play pool with other inmates and watch television and all that jazz, their thoughts should literally rot away in their minds.

[Monicker 3,035]

Ohio's always been kinda fucked up.

 

 

I didn’t know about this CSNY song. I wrote a heavy, sort of end of the world, gospel sounding thing on organ today that i named Ohio. I’m not changing the name. 

 

 

Did anyone read this comment on the ABC article linked to in the OP? 

 

 

I work in corrections. Inmates of of his size/looks are turned out pretty quick in prison and are turned into "pillow biters." He can request protective custody but you generally go in PC AFTER something happens to you, not just because say you are afraid. In fact, he already has that look about him. I suspect bad stuff has already happened to him while in jail while the security staff was elsewhere (they can't prevent everything). I've seen inmates rip the sink off the wall on their last day in segregation to get written up again and stay in segregation to avoid going back into general population because of what was happening to them on the yard. I didn't realize WHY they acted out until much later when I became more familiar with the prison culture. Early in my career I didn't recognize "the look" in some of the inmates but now I do. And TJ Lane has it already. His smirk/obscene gesture are a last ditch attempt to feel like he is in some sort of control of his life.

 

 

I don't know, that really stood out to me, coming from someone who's worked within that system. There doesn't seem to be an adequate solution with the binary we have of either life in prison or the death penalty. It's all incredibly depressing--the sort of stuff that leads to this, the tragedy and loss itself, the unfathomable emotions that the families and friends have to go through for the rest of their lives, the fear that this sort of thing leaves with the public (it seems school shootings are just going to keep happening because it's an easy thing for troubled people to mimic), and then...what, the prison system? That's fucked too. There is so much violence and abuse in that environment, both amongst inmates and towards inmates by the prison staff. 

[evilentity 13,343]

Wow, pinup, you've almost outdone yourself here. Where to start...
 

Since you don't believe in the death penalty, what about torturing? That sounds really wicked....but if hes not gonna die......where exactly is the justice?

Aside from a sense of catharsis for the victim or survivors, what exactly does violent punishment achieve? It has not proven to be an effective deterrent. In my view, wishing violence upon someone, even a violent criminal, comes from the same dark corner of the human heart as the shooter's actions. And don't even get me fucking started on torture.
 

Our taxes pay for his life? Im not exactly comfortable with providing a "nice enough" place for a prisoner.

As TPD points out, the costs associated with capital punishment (costs of holding someone on death row, costs of the method of execution, costs of the appeals process, etc.) can often equal or exceed the cost of life imprisonment. If you're really that concerned about your tax dollars, you might advocate instead for the end of our failed war on drugs which is largely responsible for the incarceration of 1 out of 6 African American men. You know, those black people you love so much. Saying we should kill someone because it's cheaper is careening down a slippery slope at terminal velocity. I know I'm inviting an invocation of Godwin's Law here, but Hitler's hatred of Jews wasn't the only determining factor in the scale of the holocaust. It accelerated as a form of resource management as the Germans were losing the war. In other words, conditions worsened and they killed people faster because they couldn't afford to keep them alive. (On a side note, I wonder sometimes what would have happened with our Japanese internment camps if we had lost the war.)
 

I suppose he will be either killed or beat in prison though. 

Ugh, this bothers me so much: the idea that the failure of our prison system to effectively prevent prisoners from assaulting other prisoners is somehow a feature, not a bug. You didn't mention rape specifically, but the prison system is perhaps the ultimate example of rape culture. Prison rape is treated as a joke in countless movies and TV shows (a particularly egregious recurring sketch on SNL comes to mind). It's wielded as a threat by cops on TV crime dramas (even on fucking SVU!), art which sadly imitates life. It's fucking sick and hardly anyone objects to it simply because the victims are unsympathetic figures. But Jesus Christ, it's still fucking rape!

OK, sorry to go on a rant about prison rape there. But the same arguments apply to non-sexual prison assaults.

[lola 6,640]

Since you don't believe in the death penalty, what about torturing?

 

Yeah, sounds like a good compromise.

[FROGGO 2,806]

I think we're having good discourse about a very controversial issue, and in the context of a shooting that people are emotionally invested in... I just think there's no need to sling words around. There's no ill-intent here. Let's share our thoughts and learn from one another and come to a better understanding or draw different conclusions, kay? :3

[Viva 3,169]

Death penalty is a delicate subject. I am against death penalty because I don't believe anyone or any system should be legaly allowed to take a life. That said I can think in a bunch of killers, rapists, kidnappers that deserve cruel torture and death. But that is the thing: is an eye for an eye really justice? I don't think so at least not lawfully.

 

And the amount of money spend in prisons and the inmates? I think about all that and consider but in the end I don't believe anyone should have the legal right to take someone else's life even if that someone violated others right. But if a rapist, a kidnapper just disappears before gets to prison I wouldn't complain.

[VegasBaby 895]

He's going to prison. You can't bring the people he killed back just by killing him, it won't help anyone.

Of course not.

 

But I just think, if God forbid, I or anyone I know had children and that happened to them, what I or they would think. Have you seen some programmes where people go to prison? Not the idea of what I would think a prison would look like, it seems too lenient to me. They can get free education and things like that. Those kids won't get the chance to graduate but people who go to prison may get out one day..

[lola 6,640]

But I just think, if God forbid, I or anyone I know had children and that happened to them, what I or they would think. Have you seen some programmes where people go to prison? Not the idea of what I would think a prison would look like, it seems too lenient to me. They can get free education and things like that. Those kids won't get the chance to graduate but people who go to prison may get out one day..

 

I'm sure they make it look a lot more civil and less horrible. Can you imagine being in a cell that fulfills the minimum of what is legal for almost the entire day, barely have any contact to the outside world, be treated like an animal, being locked behind bars, being handcuffed whenever you are allowed to leave your cell etc. etc. Prison is horrible enough without being beaten or raped on a regular basis. Even if he gets out, it will be nearly impossible to find a job and be accepted by the community he lives in.

[Mileena 2,691]

in this case, i don't think capital punishment is the way forward, i believe that this guy has obviously got something wrong with him, nobody in the right state of mind would do that kind of thing, surely? i think that this 'man' should have to serve life in prison (as in actually dying in prison, not just 20-30 years) and i don't think he should be allowed to interact with other members of the public outside of prison as i believe he is a danger. 

[Viva 3,169]

Look at this nut job actions..in my mind there is only 2 options:

 

1) hes is a nut job. Absolutely cuckoo. I mean even in the nut jobs world his actions don't make any sense. Lock him in a mental institution and throw away the keys.

 

2) He is incredible smart and has a good lawyer. Well if he waanted to use "crazy person "card for sure he achieved the requirements after using that shirt to court and talking like he did. As far as I am concerned the crazy people part of prison is better than the jail for life part. So there you go the nut job got himself a window maybe after using that shirt.

 

Either way I can't see redemption in him. How can someone turn back from that? It changes you it has to change you inside taking lifeslike that. It's scary how easy is too loose your humanity and I think this guy lost his.

 

I think hard core prisioners (rapists, aggressive killers, kidnappers, mass murders, pedophile's, molestors) should be in prison for the rest of their lives. I can understand a robery gone wrong. Maybe that one killer will achieve redemption and fully regret for the rest of his life one bad action but a mass murder? A rapist or pedophile? How can you recover a person who is that sick? Or a killer with the instinct and intention to kill? Why those people get back to society is a thing I never fully understood. To me a pedo will be a pedo forever is a diseasy with no treatement.

[TrailerParkDarling 5,691]

Look at this nut job actions..in my mind there is only 2 options:

 

1) hes is a nut job. Absolutely cuckoo. I mean even in the nut jobs world his actions don't make any sense. Lock him in a mental institution and throw away the keys.

 

2) He is incredible smart and has a good lawyer. Well if he waanted to use "crazy person "card for sure he achieved the requirements after using that shirt to court and talking like he did. As far as I am concerned the crazy people part of prison is better than the jail for life part. So there you go the nut job got himself a window maybe after using that shirt.

 

Either way I can't see redemption in him. How can someone turn back from that? It changes you it has to change you inside taking lifeslike that. It's scary how easy is too loose your humanity and I think this guy lost his.

 

I think hard core prisioners (rapists, aggressive killers, kidnappers, mass murders, pedophile's, molestors) should be in prison for the rest of their lives. I can understand a robery gone wrong. Maybe that one killer will achieve redemption and fully regret for the rest of his life one bad action but a mass murder? A rapist or pedophile? How can you recover a person who is that sick? Or a killer with the instinct and intention to kill? Why those people get back to society is a thing I never fully understood. To me a pedo will be a pedo forever is a diseasy with no treatement.

 

Well, he isn't certifiably insane. His lawyers tried that defense but it was proven that TJ was faking. You can't just say ~I'm insane~ and everything be cool, it takes a lot of psychoanalytical testing and testimony from psychologists..and preferably there was a history of psychiatric treatment prior to the incident. Not all criminals are mentally insane. Some people are just inherently bad, imo. Or negative behaviors are learned.  Aggression in juveniles is never a good thing + associated with violent tendencies. Get into criminology theories here- social learning/ disorganization,etc. but my point is that being a criminal, no matter how vile the act, does not always equate to mental insanity.  

 

I think people can seek redemption in themselves but it would be hard to do in prison..I think you just try to stay alive there..I guess that's why so many prisoners on death-row  / with a life term become devout ..something to live for/ hope for afterlife? And I don't think there is any way he will get out on parole ever- he has as much of a chance as Manson

[NamiraWilhelm 5,043]

I love how many people are anti death penalty in here, really, it's very refreshing to read others feeling that way.

 

I don't believe people are born bad, I believe they're made bad, so I cannot condone the death penalty at all.

[Viva 3,169]

Wow, pinup, you've almost outdone yourself here. Where to start...

 

Aside from a sense of catharsis for the victim or survivors, what exactly does violent punishment achieve? It has not proven to be an effective deterrent. In my view, wishing violence upon someone, even a violent criminal, comes from the same dark corner of the human heart as the shooter's actions. And don't even get me fucking started on torture.

What do you think about the study people do on criminals? Treat them like lab mouses? Its a honest question I have diverge opinions about such thing. Sometimes I think is the right thing to do since we, the society, will be able to get more information how their minds works, operates and be able to prevent or at least understand better their thoughts. On the other hand I think is one of the bases of holocaust. Study humans, people of flash and blood who think and feel, treat them like robots with no care what so ever.

 

I am against animal study also most times and in other days I am not. Is very confusing since I am a animal lover  but when I stop and think about all the people who have terrible diseases such as cancer or parkinson and got a better life or a chance because they study first on animals I feel a little towards to think is the least of 2 evils. Such thought I apply to the criminals used like lab rats. I think is dispicable sometimes but if I think that the police was able to find a criminal, a rapist for example, before he strikes another victim I think is the right thing to do.

 

 

As TPD points out, the costs associated with capital punishment (costs of holding someone on death row, costs of the method of execution, costs of the appeals process, etc.) can often equal or exceed the cost of life imprisonment. If you're really that concerned about your tax dollars, you might advocate instead for the end of our failed war on drugs which is largely responsible for the incarceration of 1 out of 6 African American men. You know, those black people you love so much. Saying we should kill someone because it's cheaper is careening down a slippery slope at terminal velocity. I know I'm inviting an invocation of Godwin's Law here, but Hitler's hatred of Jews wasn't the only determining factor in the scale of the holocaust. It accelerated as a form of resource management as the Germans were losing the war. In other words, conditions worsened and they killed people faster because they couldn't afford to keep them alive. (On a side note, I wonder sometimes what would have happened with our Japanese internment camps if we had lost the war.)

I really like your takes is very interesting what you said. Can you give a take in what you think about this: I had a great teacher in world history and once we study the power of fear and creation of invisible enemies. How what they induced in the german society against the jews happened before and still happens today. Muslims is the easy choice for example but have several others. In the muslim case do you think certain countries did and are still doing exactly what Hitler did to certain arab/muslim countries? They armed the enemy, they created the monster so they could finally have to battle the enemy, invisible enemy, of their own creation?

 

 

 

 

Ugh, this bothers me so much: the idea that the failure of our prison system to effectively prevent prisoners from assaulting other prisoners is somehow a feature, not a bug. You didn't mention rape specifically, but the prison system is perhaps the ultimate example of rape culture. Prison rape is treated as a joke in countless movies and TV shows (a particularly egregious recurring sketch on SNL comes to mind). It's wielded as a threat by cops on TV crime dramas (even on fucking SVU!), art which sadly imitates life. It's fucking sick and hardly anyone objects to it simply because the victims are unsympathetic figures. But Jesus Christ, it's still fucking rape!

 

OK, sorry to go on a rant about prison rape there. But the same arguments apply to non-sexual prison assaults.

 

I think you are absolutely right but I can't feel sorry for a rapist that is rape or a pedo that is rape. I know my take is wrong and like you said comes from a dark place but if I am being completely honest I don't feel sorry. Not that I want that person to be raped forever but to taste a couple times what he/she inflicted in their victims.   In the other hand I think the justice system and the State failures those criminals when they allow such thing to happen because such thing isn't right. Like I am not a judge or a senator or a prison director so my feelings don't affect directly the situation even if the way I think is somewhat condencent with such horrible action in prison. If I was in a position of real power I wouldn't be allowed to feel the way I feel because my take would have to be fair and in prol of real justice.

[PinUpGaloreLana 1,399]

As happy as i would be to see that bastard die, he would be better off being left to rot in a prison cell for the rest of his life. The death penalty only goes around in a little loop. One man kills someone, or in this case many, then another man has to kill that man. That would just make them as bad as eachother.

But that doesnt mean i dont hate the fucker.

Deserves to be ripped to pieces. Laughing after killing those innocent children. Even prison is too comfortable for him. Leave him alone in the middle of the desert and we should just watch him try to survive.

[pussycat 123]

 

It devalues life. I also believe that the death penalty is an easy way out, a life sentence is harder.

First off, I wanna say I like your point of view and I am learning from your posts. But, it takes a lot of money to keep someone in jail. Tax payers money. The truth is, these types of human beings can not be rehabilitated to function in society the way you or I can. The bottom line is that they are too dangerous and too much liability. And in a case like this, I support the death penalty.

[pussycat 123]

I don't know much about this, but I will share my opinion on a death penalty.

A death penalty shouldn't be allowed because it is less suffering than actually being in prison their whole life. I do agree that it is bad enough that this man took the lives of children, but the police officer who has to kill the killer will feel guilty all his life (most likely) and in my opinion, if I was a police officer who had to do that, I would feel sincerely depressed for a while and it will always be at the back of my mind. I think killing a few people is bad enough, but there is no need to take another life for the sake of that.

He should live to a very old age in prison, with the basic human rights.

I don't get why he would turn up in court like that. What a mess. And the cheek he has to laugh. I repeat, I don't know much about this. He could of been civil about it, and at least apologize and turn up in appropriate clothing.

 

*I like to rant about stuff so I will stop here as I will end up talking about his parents and gun laws*

I believe its a medical professional doing it...I could be wrong but I'm almost positive 

 

Do you think he will ever regret what he did? Even while growing old in prison? 

I doubt the families of the victims care if he regrets it, I also doubt it. 

[pussycat 123]

No offense, but it drives me crazy when people talk about "taxes" and the death penalty.. look up how much the death penalty costs and how much it costs to house a prisoner for life..the latter is substantially less.  

 

Torturing violates 8th amendment cruel & unusual punishment- death, of course, does as well but the U.S. overlooks that..matter of convenience when it comes to staying faithful to the BOR. 

 

Justice comes in the form of a life term- he'll never have a family of his own, he'll never travel, etc. His life is over. Read up on max security prisons- it isn't a cakewalk.  Hell on earth and not good for a young boy like him (the term 'fish' comes to mind)  (btw, not saying he shouldn't be in prison cos his sentence was 100% appropriate imo)

 

I did know it costs a lot but I didn't know it was less than a life sentence. Good to know. Is it all the trials that add up? Surely it can't be the actual process?

[pinupgirls 1,056]

Wow, pinup, you've almost outdone yourself here. Where to start...

 

Aside from a sense of catharsis for the victim or survivors, what exactly does violent punishment achieve? It has not proven to be an effective deterrent. In my view, wishing violence upon someone, even a violent criminal, comes from the same dark corner of the human heart as the shooter's actions. And don't even get me fucking started on torture.

 

As TPD points out, the costs associated with capital punishment (costs of holding someone on death row, costs of the method of execution, costs of the appeals process, etc.) can often equal or exceed the cost of life imprisonment. If you're really that concerned about your tax dollars, you might advocate instead for the end of our failed war on drugs which is largely responsible for the incarceration of 1 out of 6 African American men. You know, those black people you love so much. Saying we should kill someone because it's cheaper is careening down a slippery slope at terminal velocity. I know I'm inviting an invocation of Godwin's Law here, but Hitler's hatred of Jews wasn't the only determining factor in the scale of the holocaust. It accelerated as a form of resource management as the Germans were losing the war. In other words, conditions worsened and they killed people faster because they couldn't afford to keep them alive. (On a side note, I wonder sometimes what would have happened with our Japanese internment camps if we had lost the war.)

 

Ugh, this bothers me so much: the idea that the failure of our prison system to effectively prevent prisoners from assaulting other prisoners is somehow a feature, not a bug. You didn't mention rape specifically, but the prison system is perhaps the ultimate example of rape culture. Prison rape is treated as a joke in countless movies and TV shows (a particularly egregious recurring sketch on SNL comes to mind). It's wielded as a threat by cops on TV crime dramas (even on fucking SVU!), art which sadly imitates life. It's fucking sick and hardly anyone objects to it simply because the victims are unsympathetic figures. But Jesus Christ, it's still fucking rape!

 

OK, sorry to go on a rant about prison rape there. But the same arguments apply to non-sexual prison assaults.

I agree......and in no way do I support the drug war either as I am learning to become a nutritionist I dont think drugs would exactly fit the "healthy" criteria.......... but I disagree on your view on torture. How is it not a way to go about something? More and more people would be scared to commit the crimes thus saving peoples lives....

 

 

First off, I wanna say I like your point of view and I am learning from your posts. But, it takes a lot of money to keep someone in jail. Tax payers money. The truth is, these types of human beings can not be rehabilitated to function in society the way you or I can. The bottom line is that they are too dangerous and too much liability. And in a case like this, I support the death penalty.

 

 

Im also a vegetarian which I think would fit into this, because in no way would I want a living thing to suffer, but if they have harmed another human being on purpose just to kill them, not so much. Especially a conscious human. 

[evilentity 13,343]

I didn’t know about this CSNY song.

It's probably my favorite CSNY song.

 

Two random CSNY sidenotes:

1. The dude depicted in the graffiti on the wall at Nublu is the guy who signed CSN to Atlantic Records and suggested the addition of Y.

2. Jimmy Fallon has done several spot-on impressions of Neil Young doing ridiculous covers. Go watch them all.

 

I wrote a heavy, sort of end of the world, gospel sounding thing on organ today that i named Ohio. I’m not changing the name.

 Time to start an "Unleaked Monicker Songs" thread.