Valentino

Psychologists don't draw conclusions about people without having talked to them for a significant period of time. Nobody here knows Lana, no matter what we may think after having heard so much of her music or seeing her interviews. I do think it's inappropriate to speculate that her mom did anything to her of any sort without hard proof. It's entirely unfair to ruin Pat's reputation over a "feeling" - remember when people got carried away and started suggesting "Lana was in love with and wanted to run away with her English teacher~" over some song lyrics and like two interview quotes? Remember when people accused Jimmy Gnecco of domestic violence because of UV? As fans, we want to know everything, but I do think there's a difference between curiosity and making damning accusations that can have very real consequences. And if this sort of theory catches on, it's nigh-near impossible to correct it (some interview already mentioned the English teacher). Rumors spread, facts don't. With response to her alcoholism... Lana said she started drinking because the concept seemed "so fucking cool." And then she realized she was using drink to deal anytime she had a problem, and that's when she couldn't stop. Lana also says stuff like "I haven't had a drink in 10 years" when we have Facebook posts of her being relieved that alcohol is going to be offered at a party. She's given her reasons for her teenage alcoholism, we shouldn't come up with new ones without evidence. She definitely went to Fordham. Check the 76 page on Minor Questions; there's people who went to Fordham who know about her. There are Fordham publications that refer to her as a graduate. I emailed the alumni office and they confirmed she graduated in 2008 with a degree in philosophy. How she completed her degree is a question because she claims she did some independent study business, but I don't think it's fair at all to say her time at Fordham was "a lie" just because she doesn't talk about it much. Let's be real - university education is not valued by the music business, so why would interviewers care about that? As for Lana's "shadiness" ... she has a right to her privacy, and she's said more than once that she'd rather talk about the music than what's happened in her life. She's very loose with numbers; she's notoriously unreliable with regards to accurately telling how long ago something else happened, which is probably part of the reason why we can't construct a perfectly fitting timeline for her. I don't think she's only "shady" about her early years; she generally doesn't seem to like talking about her life. Chuck mentioned, in her interview with Lana, how she [Lana] hates it when people mythologize her past, especially the trailer park. I'm confident that her living in a trailer park was about getting away from her parents, proving she can make it on her own, and finding her own identity as an artist. How many kids leaving the nest get excited about living in some stupid rinky-dink place just because, for once, it's theirs? Lady Gaga lived in such an apartment for a year or so before getting her record deal for similar reasons, and her parents also came from money, so I don't think a sinister past is her reason for living in a trailer park. I'm going to end this post with two relevant Lana lyrics: "Stop looking at my trainwreck life and start listening to the way that I sing the blues." "And make up stories about my life and put on very cherry balm."

All I Want For Christmas Is the loon You

The screenshots was simply serendipitous: someone bumped this thread, bringing it to the front page. Unfortunately some of the images beyond the 1st page are broken, so I couldn't use them. I found out about Lynn's blog and his flickr through Lanalysis. I also got dates for Mizrahi from there, too. And anything else is just looking stuff up. evil's early shows section helped, as well as this list of interviews I had saved. And it's good that I get to make this 2nd post because I want to add some stuff about Steven Mertens. Here's a bunch of interviews mentioning him, plus evilentity's world-class sleuthing: Steve Mertens 1 In a Lizzy Grant-era piece for the Huffington Post, she told a reporter, “Strangest performance: Alone in a basement for a handsome record executive. Strangest [song] ever written: Back at his office while I was making out with him.” When I ask her if she regrets joking like that, given how often people perceived her as a puppet of some executive team, she says, no, the story was true: “I had a seven-year relationship with the head of this label, and he was a huge inspiration to me. I’ll tell you later when more people know. He never signed me, but he was like my muse, the love of my life.” (JUNE 4 2014, FADER) (the referenced interiew is form May 25, 2011) 2 You could work with outside songwriters. Are you open to that kind of thing a bit more now? Lana: Yeah, I’m more open to it now, ‘cause personally I’m not really feeling it. (Laughs) Like this guy I worked with eight years ago, Steven Mertens, who made my first record [editor’s note: David Kahne is credited as the producer of her debut, 2010’s Lana Del Ray a.k.a. Lizzy Grant; Mertens is a member of the Brooklyn band Spacecamp]. He knew me really well. 3 Now, I know you don’t love to talk about this because journalists have sort of mythologized your past but let’s talk about the trailer park you lived in for a few years- I shot you there when you were 22 [my note: 2007] and continued to shoot you there for a couple years while you were writing and entertaining and wrapping up your album with David Kahne. You were so sweet and happy that you had your very own place to write and reside in, and extra money from that $10,000 indie contract. It was also a sad time for you because you separated from Steven Mertens who had originally produced that record and who was your boyfriend at the time. I don’t really have to ask you this because as your sister, I think I already know, but would you say this was your most enriching time as an artist and happiest time in New York (despite the split from Steven.) (GALORE INTERVIEW 2014) 4 (the saddest one, imo) Why did you choose to cover Nina Simone’s “The Other Woman” on Ultraviolence? [Sings, “The other woman has time to manicure her nails, the other woman is perfect where her rival fails.”] I relate to being the person who people come to for “such a change from the old routine,” but not being the main thing. I had a long-term relationship for seven years with someone who was the head of a label and I felt like I was that change of routine. I was always waiting to become the person who his kids came home to, and it never happened. Obviously I had to seek other relationships, and I felt like that became a pattern. I was younger—24, 25 at the time. I had known what I wanted to do for a long time. I had been serious about music since high school, and I stopped drinking when I was 18. (Complex august 2013) 5 EVILENTITY ANALYSIS TrailerParkDarling, 16 Aug 2013: Steven Mertens used to play back up w/ her, I guess at various gigs. He used to w/ Regina Spektor, too http://web.archive.o...ace.com/4026640 SitarHero, Aug 16 2013: But no seriously Sirens was 8 years ago and AKA wasn't...like I think she may have just actually referenced it. Hnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnng I totally overlooked the "eight years ago" part at first ( at a possible reference to Sirens or her other early recordings) but I'd been meaning to contact Steven Mertens for months since @Trash Magic and I put some things together about him (which perhaps belong in Lanalysis). When I saw she mentioned him by name in this article, I got on that immediately and sent him an e-mail. I'll report back any response, but please don't bother him in case it interferes with my attempts to correspond with him. In addition to sharing the bill with her at a Cross-Pollination show, and playing in her backing band as TPD noted (he's the guy that looks sort of like McNulty from The Wire in the Canal Room videos), Mertens has actually been referred to in at least two other interviews with Lana. Remember that Megan and Menace in the Mornings interview? When I was young, my boyfriend in the city made my first record. His best friend Jack was Regina [spektor]'s longtime boyfriend. They're married now. (You can listen here at around 5:20.) Regina Spektor (who TPD notes Mertens also played for) is married to Jack Dishel who was in a band called The Moldy Peaches. Guess who else was in The Moldy Peaches? Steven Mertens. I wasn't completely convinced at first that that's who she was talking about (I thought it was more likely another Moldy Peaches member, Adam Green, since his initials are AG, likely a red herring) until @Trash Magic pointed out something I'd missed-- in that Mizrahi interview she said: One of the first producers I worked with, Steven Saint, learned a lot from Dick Dale (father of surf music, pre-Beach Boys) so the beginning of the sound was influenced by some sounds from Hawaii and surf guitars, so that’s where the surf comes from. A little digging shows that Steven Saint = Steven Mertens (see here and here). 6 (surf music + Steven Mertens is from LA) I had a very handsome ex boyfriend from here [interview takes place in California] once. Surf punk rock bands. It was loud all the time in the house, in the car. (KPRI interview) (also notice she calls him handsome here and refers to the record executive as "handsome," too. Makes me think of For K Part 2: "how you get so handsome, my boy?") For reference, a pic of Steven Mertens in 2008. That thing where she mentioned feeling like a change of routine... wow. That got me, honestly. And now for some more discrepancies... Who are these people? RADIO GUY I mean you know people always said you know people will come out of the woodwork and change their mind about you. They’ll start to like you ‘cause you’re on the radio. And it is true but I don’t mind ‘cause I’d rather people be nice to me. I don’t really care why people are nice to me I just lie it when it’s easier. I just wrote it when this guy that I used to know came back into my life. So now my life is sweet like cinnamon. Cause he came back. (ITALIAN INTERVIEW on FACEBOOK, MAR 12 2012) RICH GUY "It's a song about a man who thought I was one of the most exotic things he had ever seen and me indulging in his appreciation and love. On the outside he was handsome and wholesome, but under wraps he was running an illegal electronic business which ended up taking him and his friends under." (Unknown interview, about MDM) Like, you know, I used to live a really crazy life and, like, OTTR is one of those songs were you can tell by the energy of it that I’m right in the middle of, like, a relationship where times were happy but also chaotic. We were travelling between LA and Las Vegas, he- I can’t gamble ‘cause I’m not good, he was gambling, I was just swimming. (ITALIAN FB interview, MAR 12 2012) ALABAMA (this could be Mertens since one of the May Jailer pages listed Alabama as a place and that would've been pre-Lynn) I lived down in Alabama with my boyfriend, I lived here in Brooklyn and in Jersey. I’ve been a lot of different people, I guess.” (FADER JULY 2014) LONG TIME LOVE MAN + EX BOYFRIEND COUCH MAN What about love and loss, the other dark note in her oeuvre? “I felt the same way for a really long time, and then I met someone who I guess I fell in love with,” she says. “I just didn’t know I could feel differently. That time with him became sort of a place that I fell back to in my memory.” And the breakup? “Well, I mean, the breakup is a part of it in the way that in the midst of loss you try to still look towards the light and not fall to pieces or do self-destructive things.” […] Before she goes, I ask her where she lives. She’s looking to buy a place, but for now is in Williamsburg. “Staying with my ex-boyfriend,” she says nonchalantly, then bursts into nervous laughter and admits, “I live on his couch.” I give her a look like, You just told me all that about falling in love and breaking up and you’re on the dude’s couch? She pins it on the touring, letting out another embarrassed laugh. “Because no, I’m busy though!” (FEB9 2012) REHAB ROCK STAR (Jimmy Gnecco?) Which lyric are you most proud of? There was an older song that you've never heard called "Pawn Shop Blues". [sings] "In the name of higher consciousness / I let the best man I met go / Because it's nice to love and be loved but it's better to know all you can know." Because I remember I'd met someone so special and famous but I knew he wasn't enlightened about how to be a good person. I knew it would get in the way of me becoming a nice person. That's a difficult choice to make. How did you meet this famous person? Um, it was in a self-help group. [laughs]. He wasn't that famous. I just thought he was famous… TV famous or movie star famous? Rock star famous. Just middle of the road ish. To me he was famous because I didn't know anyone who was wildly recognisable. I remember thinking it was exciting at the time. (SEP 19 2011) VIDEO GAMES MAN (MEN) (supposedly VG is about Mike Mizrahi, and he supposedly tried to control her career) Lana: Video Games was a song that came after I abandoned all ambition of becoming anyone noteworthy in music. It was only ten months ago. I just wrote it when I felt love again. It was about a time when it was nice to focus on a relationship and simple things; watching your boyfriend play videogames. It sounds sad, but it was sort of happy. I’d let go of the idea of being a singer because things had gone so terribly for so long.(SEP 23 2011) LDR: A boy. I think we came together because we were both outsiders. It was perfect. But I think with that contentment also comes sadness. There was something heavenly about that life – we'd go to work and he'd play his video games - but also it was maybe too regular. At the time I was becoming disillusioned with being a singer and was very happy to settle with a boyfriend who I loved, but in the end we both lost sight of our dreams. Maybe there's something not-so-special about domestic life. (OCT 4 2011) “The verse was about the way things were with one person, and the chorus was the way that I wished things had really been with another person, who I thought about for a long time,” she says, breaking into an acapella of the song. “‘Swinging in the backyard, pull up in your fast car, whistling my name’. That was what happened, you know? He’d come home and I’d see him. But then the chorus, ‘Heaven is a place on earth with you, tell me all the things you wanna do’ wasn’t like that. That was the way that I wished it was – the melody sounds so compelling and heavenly because I wanted it to be that way. The verse is more matter-of-fact because that’s how it was. It’s a mix of memories and the way I wished it could have been. Just because things happened a certain way doesn’t mean that that’s the way that they are. (Dazed 2011) (NOTE: She's said in a more recent interview that many of her songs are like this - the verses about one person and the chorus about another. I am pretty sure she said this about West Coast; I need to track that interview down) BTD, VG, BJ - a trilogy about one guy? (5:47)Q: I didn't realize until recently that Born To Die, and Video Games, and Blue Jeans, you said they were kind of a trilogy about this one dude and his effect on you and your relationship and what you thought. Is he, Adele-style, is he aware of that? Have you talked to him about that? Is he aware of the reaction it's getting? L: What is Adele style? Q: She's very vocal about this one person. It's about this person and we talk about it and now we can have a laugh about it, but the time there was so much emotion going on. L: He doesn't know. His mother knows. We're in touch. But no. Q: He hasn't pieced it together and gone hey! L: Not really.

Arthur Lynn is an ex-boyfriend of hers. You can read about some exes and potential exes in Lanalysis - it's a good place to get started on the "Lana world," although some of the info in the first post is outdated.

Potential Arthur Lynn stuff. I was looking for an Arthur Lynn blog post and ended up looking through his posts. I noticed he referred to Van Halen as "kings" and the "band that changed my life and kicked me in the balls." He specifically tags them as "david lee roth, diamond, edward van halen." And that reminded me of Mermaid Motel: 'maybe we could go to Suede Tokyo See Van Halen at their reunion show Heavy Metal hour on TV Diamond Dave and Ray Lee' I mean, there's nothing saying none of her other long-haired boyfriends/paramours/whatever couldn't have liked Van Halen, but: Arthur Lynn is confirmed as a boyfriend we have songs referencing his origins (Greenwich) we have songs referencing his favorite drink (Diet Mountain Dew) It doesn't seem odd that this could be a reference to him. Lana Del Rey lived in New York City from like 2006 to 2009-ish. Van Halen's reunion tour with David Lee Roth 2007-2008 had a stop in NYC November 13, 2007 and May 23, 2008. Neither of these dates would conflict with her known shows. I don't know when she wrote Mermaid Motel, but she performed it at Arlene's Grocery February 3, 2009, so it's possible for it to refer to the reunion show as a past event (as opposed to a future event). Ray Lee is currently a drummer for Korn but "served as the drummer of the Van Halen frontman’s solo band from 1997 to 2005, performing on 1998′s ‘DLR Band’ and 2003′s ‘Diamond Dave’ albums." I'm still not sure about Suede Tokyo. There is a band by the name of Suede and they have indeed performed in Tokyo, but I don't know why Lana would refer to that. More educated people, help? So I'm speculating Mermaid Motel is about Arthur Lynn. Which brings me to something else... One site listed Lynn's interests as such (trying to find the site since, like an idiot, I just saved the interests). Pay attention to the bolded ones. music, girls, guitars, america, diet mountain dew, van halen, ice cream, photography, jersey, angiescreams, indian summer, woods, food, freckles, the sun, the moon, seasons, amplifiers, family, friends, karma, october, yo mama, yo mama's apple pie, and those little people we call doggies JERSEY Note his blog is subtitled "thoughts from a jersey boy." His flickr lists his hometown as Jersey but "currently" (not sure when screenshot was taken) Greenwich, CT. I was already pretty sure that Motel 6 was about Lynn due to DMD references, but "to Jersey with love" makes more sense now. MORE VAN HALEN STUFF + CONEY ISLAND + YOUR MOM: This is the most recent screenshot I’m showing – we’re going in reverse chronological order, from ‘last login date.’ In this screenshot from her Lizzy Grant MySpace, url therichwhores, she lists Diamond Dave as an influence (along with Britney Spears and motorcycles, two other lasting influences). Notice she lists her location as New Jersey. Also notice that she describes her music as metal - not a musical genre I would put any Lana Del Rey song in, ever. I wonder if Arthur Lynn, who could conceivably be the one into "heavy metal hour," influenced her calling her music "metal." She's still therichwhores here, but her location is now Alabama. Her genre is glam, blues, experimental. No metal – not yet, anyway. David Lee Roth is one of 3 influences, along with Britney Spears and motorcycles. The earliest Rich Whores screenshot I’m showing. In this one, she lists David Lee Roth and Coney Island as influences... along with "your mom." Yeah, just like Mr. Lynn listed "yo mama." Britney and motorcycles remain, but the other influences have shifted. Arthur Lynn is explicitly listed as a member here. She's living in New York now. (aside: pretty things is an influence here. we'll see that again later) AMERICA Lana said this about one of her ex-boyfriends: Lynn loves rock and roll, that's perfectly clear. But what distinguishes him from Gnecco or Carney or other musical liaisons? Well, the 4th 'like' listed by Lynn was America. It's a weak connection, but I don't think we've ever tied that comment to any other boyfriend. Lana didn't always talk or sing about America. Her May Jailer era stuff, for example, seems more focused on the details of personal relationships than concepts like America or archetypes like the gangster boyfriend. I don't know when Lana started playing with Lynn, but it'd be curious to see if that date coincides with an increasing number of references to Americana. If we assume Mermaid Motel is about Lynn, then we also have a connection to Coney Island, another interest of hers that you don't see mentioned in the early days. To see how big the change from her May Jailer stuff to her Lizzy/Lana stuff was, let's look at more MySpace pages... Folk, acoustic, experimental! Only one of these genre descriptors survived into the post-May Jailer MySpace descriptors. Her influences are Bob Dylan, Allen Ginsberg, Nirvana, Leonard Cohen, Radiohead... only Nirvana is repeated as an influence in the later MySpace page, although Daniel Johnston seems to be in the vein of singer-songwritery stuff. A year later (according to last-login date) and "Cony Island" (sic) and "pretty things" have been added as influences. She's now experimental, blues, folk - the acoustic part is gone. Another mid-2000s screenshot shows "Bread and Oranges" appearing alongside Money Hunny, Fordham Road, and A Star for Nick. It now has its final name, Pawn Shop Blues, and For K Part 2 has shown up - the LDR album appears to be forming (Jump, Kill Kill, and Put Me In A Movie show up in the Lizzy screenshots above). The last login date for this one is 5/17/2007, whereas the last login date for the earliest Rich Whores page is 12/12/2007. It appears to be a transitional state, not just with regards to her layout, but also her name and influences. The music is less acoustic. Coney Island starts showing up, as well as motorcycles and Van Halen. Metal inexplicably becomes a descriptor. Would fit in pretty well with Arthur Lynn showing up… just sayin’. (one last thing... under band members, she lists "TAGS & TIM." Who are these people?) CONCLUSION? From 2007-ish to maybe 2009-ish, Lana dated Arthur Lynn. Arthur Lynn may be the boyfriend who loved rock-n-roll and America. Before his introduction into her band (and we don't know when they met, so they could have met before Lynn was part of the Rich Whores), Americana references were rare in her music, she made singer-songwritery stuff about people's lives, and she basically had a very different persona. Lynn becomes part of the Rich Whores, she now likes Van Halen, specifically David Lee Roth and the album Diamond Dave, Coney Island (all mentioned in Mermaid Motel), her music is described very differently (metal, really?; and glam), she somehow picks up on his jokes (yo mama)... I think he was an influential boyfriend. Oh, and to tie this back to other boyfriends... According to the Galore interview by Chuck, Lana broke up with Steve Mertens when she was 22. So 2007? Lana mentioned a seven-year relationship with a record producer in the 2014 Fader interview and I think Mertens is the only one who could potentially fit that. Which would make the timeline of that relationship 2000-2007. Which means she would have been 15 when she started dating Mertens... If Mertens is the 7 year relationship (and I don't think any of the other ones could be that relationship), then that means she would have had 4 major ex-boyfriends. Mertens 2000-2007. Lynn 2007 to 2008 or 2009 Mizrahi 2009 to 2011 Barrie 2012 (?) to 2014 Thoughts? It's like early in the morning and I've spent a couple hours doing this, so I'd like fresh eyes.

Supposedly "Lana Del Rey" is something she got from hanging out with "Cuban friends" in Miami and it reminded her of the "glamour of the seaside." I think there's another variant of it, Lana Ray, which you'll hear in Trash Magic ("He said, Lana Ray, will you serve me lemonade?"). I recall reading about a fourth variant but I don't remember what it was, only that it was longer. I think the Ray spelling is something that comes naturally to English speakers because, well, it's an existing word and name and it has the same pronunciation as Rey. I speak Spanish and even I sometimes slip up and type Lana Del Ray because that sound sequence, in English, corresponds to the sequence of letters "ray." I think she changed it to Rey so the whole thing would be in Spanish (she supposedly speaks Spanish, and we've heard her speaking little pieces of Spanish before) as opposed to partially in English - consistency. Maybe it's a coincidence that she also sings about a Ray in Kill Kill and potentially Raise Me Up (the demo is called "Rayse." I know Lana loves misspelling things but considering she's sung about a Ray before and she does ring 'Rai rai rai raise me up', her singing about an actual Ray in that song would fit pretty well). Maybe she liked this coincidence and capitalized upon it. I don't know the timeline of stage names she's had, I don't know when she started using Lana Del Rey instead of Ray, I'm not even sure if Lana Ray was ever used as a stage name. Something neat I found in the Lanalysis page: Arthur Lynn wanted to name his daughter Lana... and his son Ray.

I don't think I'm saying more than what you've said, honestly, unless you're aiming this at someone else, in which case carry on! (I definitely don't think she was sexually abused or her mother was unusually harsh on her)

There's an interview where Lana says her dad thought the opening line of Cola was hilarious whereas her mom didn't approve. I get the feeling maybe her mom was more concerned with seeming proper, preserving decorum and whatnot. The line in Old Money "my father's love was always strong, my mother's glamour lives on and on" is interesting. I mean, she's comparing her father's love to her mother being glamorous, kind of a downgrade. The fact that she mentions her father a lot ("I pledge allegiance to my dad for teaching me everything he knows," "that's the way my father made his life an art," "I heard the streets were paved with gold, that's what my father said") whereas her mom is rarely mentioned in her music (the unflattering "My Momma" and that line in "Old Money") makes me think her father was simply more influential and important in her life. If the Cola quote is anything to go by, her mother seems to disapprove of weird, off-beat stuff like saying your pussy tastes like Cola, and Lana is a weird, off-beat person, so that may have been a point on contention in Lana's family life. Moreover, My Momma shows her disapproving of a boyfriend. Dear Elliott also refers to a boyfriend who was "not approved." Now, My Momma also suggests her mother had a thing for her boyfriend, which is where the song gets weird. And despite Lana claiming her songs are 100% autobiographical, we can't take them at face value. Personally, I don't think her mother didn't love her or whatever. They didn't jibe in some senses; maybe Mom wanted Lana to fit into society more whereas Dad was cool with it. That's what I get from her music and the rare times she's mentioned her. We know so little about her that I don't think it's fair to draw any conclusions about their relationship.

It took me a really long time to like this song. The only thing I liked about it at the beginning was the sitar-like sound at the beginning, and then the verse started and a farting synth happened. The second part of the verse sounded like the world's most demented merry-go-round, and the chorus was kind of gross. After many repeated listenings, for whatever reason, I started to appreciate the psychedelic circus of sitar players. And now... I can even say that I like it. (I don't know what Liquid Television is so I can't appreciate this reference )

On the topic of the post-BTD album that could have been, I found these two interviews from before the 5 tracks leaked: (Feb 28, 2013: ) From this interview: "moved on to a more spiritual place lyrically,” The bombshell said she is already gunning to make a music video for her new track titled, ‘Black Beauty.’ “For some reason the videos are still the easiest things that come,” Lizzie Grant explained, “As soon as I write the words to a song, I can paint exactly what I want the picture to look like.” “It’s a little more stripped down but still cinematic and dark.” She said she’s been slaving away at her new tunes in Santa Monica, Calif. with the same group of guys who produced her previous work. From this interview: "Stripped back" "opening and closing with stacked acappella tracks" "West Coast influence" "still the cinematic, the orchestra is always important." She's already mentioning a "west coast" influence in that second one, but nothing else really makes me think of Ultraviolence as we got. Also, BB music video was planned. Yes, people need a reminder that Lana loves her trash (magic )

They're called untouchable because we weren't supposed to 'touch' them, and them leaking (us 'touching' them) posed a threat to the post-Paradise album. Lana wasn't happy with that leak, if you'll recall. At the time of the leaking, there were people saying that they weren't going to listen to ('touch', to continue the metaphor) the leaked songs out of respect for Lana or something (nowadays nobody cares since she didn't quit making music~ or anything). I feel pretty confident in telling you that the "untouchable" moniker refers to the nature of how we acquired them and the potential harm they represented, not to their quality as songs. I agree with you that JFK, AFFA , and Starry Eyed are boring. I won't have anyone insulting the incredible Hollywood, though. I'd love to hear an album that went in that electronic-y direction. Catch and Release is her best work okay, maybe not that far, but it's such a great song, even if the lyrics falter at time (I am a shark, beware of my bark? I'll eat you up like the center of a Tootsie Pop? )

I am so happy that I'm not the only fan in love with this song. Also, to the people saying Lana wouldn't be herself if she did fun, uptempo music... the demos to BTD were almost all happier and more upbeat than the final product, which underwent severe Haynie-fication. She's done more than her fair share of upbeat stuff. It would totally be "her" to do something quicker-paced than a dirge. Just because she became known for Video Games (and subsequently the whole of BTD became "Hollywood Softcore") doesn't mean she can't make music that's fun but still idiosyncratic.

Could you elaborate on that? I've never understood the K = Kurt Cobain theories. The only song that I would think really matches that is For K Part 2, which is very unlike other "K" songs. It has no relationship to the only other song that mentions K by name (and the only one that mentions him in the lyrics), Drive-by. I don't know much about Kurt Cobain, so forgive me if I'm ignorant, but I don't see anything in the Drive-by song that is reminiscent of him. Do you consider the "double homicide" some sort of metaphor? The song seems very literal and almost country music-like in its storytelling, so I have a hard time seeing it as metaphorical or symbolic. To jump off from that, a tiny essay on my recent K thoughts! K is from her May Jailer era, which is probably the most shrouded in mystery. There are other songs from this period, but I don't think anyone's ever convincingly tied them together or tied them to her post-acoustic stuff. The recurrence of a "nice guy" trying to make money who makes a terrible mistake and is sent to prison/death row is the only reason we even think that, for example, Blue Jeans or Off To The Races or TV In Black & White are about K. We don't have discussions about whoever "Pretty Baby" or "Next To Me" or "Star For Nick" are about because they're too vague to tie to any of her more recent music or the themes don't recur. But her May Jailer stuff was recorded a long time ago... her themes have evolved since. Except for maybe the K thing (which she instigated by renaming Rehad "For K Part 2" and further confusing us all). Moreover, the criminal description changes depending on the song. If For K Part 2 is about the same K as Drive-By, then it seems he was a musician and probably one who played guitar-based music. That'd be pretty different from the urban gangster type Lana also describes. And moreover, there's a third type - some glamorous, rich man who adored her but went under for whatever reason. I used to try and tie these all together as possibly different periods of K, but I think they're just different manifestations of the criminal fantasy Lana likes. Trying to tie this back to interviews where she mentions real people... There's an interview I've been trying to find where she says this about Million Dollar Man: Yeah, definitely Million Dollar Man (and also just like Hollywood's Dead: "you were 50s cool [...] but it was a cover for all of the trouble you got into" + "I always fall for the same type/gangsters in Vegas on game night"). There's a huge difference between running an illegal electronics business and killing two men, though, even if both get you sent to jail. She says this about OTTR, often considered a "K" song: K from Drive-By was a nice guy who somehow ended up killing two people while trying to make money (the actual profit generating action is never elaborated upon). Not rich, not living a glamorous life. Off the top of my head, the song that closest fits the specifics of K's actions is Blue Jeans: There was a drive-by Sunday night ... He headed out on Sunday, said he'd come home Monday Making money's hard to do right ... He was chasin' paper ... Told you I wanted more, that's not what I had in mind Now he's in a jail cell for some 30 years now ... Sent him onto death row, not to hang around though ... Then they took you away, stole you out of my life We used to classify most gangsta/criminal songs that did not mention a musician or music as K songs, but it seems to me that this would mean K would have been both a hip-hop head and a punk rocker who was also crazy rich while not having enough money. Recently, the only songs I've classified as K songs (insofar as K is an archetype, a character, an idea, as opposed to a real life person) are songs that mention a lover that is either in prison (TVIB&W) or dead (DP). The guys mentioned in MDM and HD (who I think are the same person) and the one in OTTR (who might be the same one as in MDM+HD) are therefore not K songs. I don't know what this means for Backfire, Dangerous Girl, National Anthem, Golden Grill, etc. One day when I have enough free time, I'm just gonna listen to all her stuff straight through and note different recurring "characters." We talk about her repeated lyrics (daddy, party dress, pale moonlight) but she certainly has repeated characters and they can't all be autobiographical. There are people she mentions in her interviews (frustratingly enough, never by name) that seem to match up with certain personages in her songs, as well, but that's another thing I'd need another day for. This is why I love being a Lana fan, by the way. The consistency in her lyrics makes it so much fun to look at her work as a whole.

Best: fff Shades of Cool, maybe? Worst: on the standard, Old Money for having a boring chorus. On the deluxe, guns and roses for its repetitiveness and flipside for its sparse production. Don't come for me, Flipside fans.

In Russia they sell a censored version of UV (****** my way up to the top) with GNR and FK as bonus tracks (not sure about Flipside, I'd have to go back and check). I'm pretty confident about it because I was just in a music store today. They also sell the UV and dual BTW/P vinyl. Stan a bit.

There needs to be a version of Godwin's law, but with Katy. "As time goes on, the probability of a pop music stan condescendingly telling someone to listen to Katy Perry approaches one." Not liking Ride doesn't make you unsophisticated. Art isn't two opposite poles of Lana and Katy. Accusing someone of liking Katy is cheap and pointless. People can like music for different purposes. Katy is a feel good artist, not an auteur, and I'm fine with that. If I want musical sophistication, I'll listen to classical, and if I want poetic sophistication, I'll read an actual poem. Let's also not pretend like Lana is the purest form of art or anything. She's a great artist, but she is so not perfect or even close. ( Dear John, please don't let me be misunderstood. )

100% agree. Black Beauty is also about Barrie. He seemed to struggle with depression and "darkness," and the song is about the difficulty of loving someone with depression. I think (this is a stretch) Shades of Cool could have shades :oops: of Barrie in it. The chorus especially: you live in shades of cool. I can't break through. I don't think he was cheating on Lana or anything like that, ofc. I wonder who Cruel World is about if it's a real life figure. Bibles, guns, heroin, candy, women. We've discussed UV and "Jim" before. I used to think BB was about Barrie, but I'm not sure anymore. West Coast is mysterious. Sad Girl sounds like a vindication of the other woman's lifestyle choices. We know nothing about the man. PWYC was improvised (supposedly), so I think it's off the cuff lyrics with no particular person in mind. I still think MPG is related to the "Holy roller" from Butterflies part 2. Hypocritical preacher who indulges in sin, anyone? Doesn't have to be someone she dated or even a real person - it could be a type of person she'd met or seen and was disgusted by. FMWUTTT is another mystery because we KNOW this is about someone. The only two I can think of that fit because of the "art project" comment (and Lana has mentioned them indirectly before) are Lorde and Lady Gaga. We've never come to a conclusion about this either. Old Money is another song about an idea, with the relationship as a backdrop. It's more about her than the guy. Florida Kilos, this is going back to old drug references. Guns N Roses refers to a heavy metal love, which recalls the type of guy mentioned in Mermaid Motel and Belair. Belair also had a GNR reference. Maybe this is why I'm not as big a fan of UV - it's harder to Lanalyze. I'm not touching the soundtrack songs or Wait for Life either.

Lana is a visual artist, not just a musical one. Her homemade music videos show that she has (or had) a visual aesthetic goal in mind when making music. She's always said she's been really guided by visual aesthetics and "beautiful things," so that's important for her. With that in mind, I don't understand why so many fans act like they're better and truer fans if they're "only here for the music." A lot of people like the visual work Lana created - and, may I point out, unlike most of her music, she made her homemade music videos by herself. If you're only here for Lana the Musician, that's great, but there's no need to act like Lana the Visual Artist is unimportant or simple "promo."

I am so here for a YCBTB performance besides that album de la semaine one (which was bad). This is exciting. Too bad I won't be here when she tours near me.

Sucker is one of my most played songs (2nd most played behind Live or Die V2 actually ) . But I really only like the first half of the album.

Party Girl. Delicious. Daddy Issues and I Was In A Bad Way. Moi je joue. Not hate, but I cringe when hearing Big Bad Wolf and its ilk (EXCEPT the unused instrumental. So cool and mysterious)

L-l-let's do drugs, make love with our teachers Get down like your tutor taught you to and PROVE IT (the early live version is cool too)

I don't even like Old Money, honestly. The verses are nice, but the chorus is awful. I prefer Methamphetamines, even with its awful quality. Dan Heath's production doesn't help; he's just pretty bland overall, I think. I'm always annoyed at how messy Lana's releases are. You're just kept in the dark and then maybe something drops. There's no excitement, imo, just frustration. A little hype (that you follow up on) is good, it gives you something to look forward to. But knowing Lana, this snippet may be all we get of LIB, honestly. PWIC video, anyone?

Sorry to bother, but could you send me too?

I really don't think Lana has what it takes to be a blues or jazz singer, honestly. Her live performances have never been very convincing to me, and some of her weakest moments have been when she tries to imitate a jazz singer (Million Dollar Man, I am staring at you). Her voice isn't really suited for it, she's not that great at ad-libbing live, she's not even really consistent with her live performances as they are now... I love her, but I dislike nearly all the live performances of hers I've looked up. She sounds nice in the studio, and I think that's where she's most comfortable. If she wants to imitate a jazz singer there, that's fine because she can do as many takes as she wants or take a break if she feels sick or whatever. But being a jazz singer live? I think the live aspect of jazz is pretty important, and Lana has never managed to impress me vocally live (there are some studio performances of hers that I'm iffy about).