Galilee, Israel @ Meteor Festival - Sep 7, 2018 (CANCELLED)

[baddisease 17,953]

its funny you're just sitting on your computer whining about something instead of directly contacting her since you're so devastated about it. You couldn't care less about palestine, ur fake wokeness is showing. 

 

Lmfao. Is "fake woke" all you people can say?

Fuck an Israel, long live Palestine.

[Amadeus 11,334]

Fuck an Israel, long live Palestine.

nnnn not when miss palestine is highly problematic itself. 

[baddisease 17,953]

nnnn not when miss palestine is highly problematic itself. 

 

Israel shouldn't even exist. Palestine, no matter how problematic, is the rightful holder of that land.

 

so again: LONG LIVE PALESTINE.

[missdelreyxo 3,786]

Lmfao. Is "fake woke" all you people can say?

Fuck an Israel, long live Palestine.

no i can elaborate further. this forums interests in political issues is as surface level as a marble counter so i'll leave it at that. 

if it bothers u so much then do something besides whining on the internet.

 

I dont even agree with Israel at all, i just dont feel a moderately popular artist should be the scapegoat for a music event that multiple artist are playing at, and that fans should call her war propaganda. get f-ing real.

[kitschesque 9,884]

Israel shouldn't even exist. Palestine, no matter how problematic, is the rightful holder of that land.

so again: LONG LIVE PALESTINE.

 

[Valerie 1,379]

1. Goodness gracious! How dare I use profanity to emphasize how trivial I find someone's desire to attend a concert to standing up for human rights! What a travesty! #CertainTravesties

2. Members of oppressor classes, particularly when they are propagandized by their government and state-friendly media, are often the last to come to terms with the reality and extent of that oppression. And if you're suggesting that my position on this issue is informed only by histrionic social media posts, that's funny. You forget I'm old and have followed this issue since long before social media existed and despite a historically strong pro-Israel bias in US media.

3. Forcing my opinion? How? I mean, I have every right to express my opinion as much as anybody else here. You say this as if I've somehow abused my mod powers to silence or punish differing views about this. I haven't. If anything, quite the opposite. Members have reported offensive posts in this thread that I think objectively warrant discipline, but I've recused myself and left them for other mods to decide. I will note it is funny how often on this forum accusations of "forcing" or "imposing" an opinion generally correlate with an inability to articulate much of a rebuttal.

 

 

This is honestly hilarious. Your quotes in their original context look way worse and make you look like that much more of an asshole. If anything I did you a favor.

 

Sigh, if I must.

 

It's a strawman, on multiple levels, but here's one: Its implicit premise is that in the quote of mine it responds to I say people have to stop saying certain ideas. I don't. I merely politely asked people keep the plight of Palestinian victims in mind as they post. I literally say please.

 

Let's see. What post of theirs did I quote and how did I respond to merit being called a "condescending asshole"? Oh. I merely mirrored their own words back to them.

Being "old and following this issue long before the media" doesn't validate/turn your opinion into a fact. Because just like you "being old and following this issue long before the media" there's plenty of members around here that are as old and OLDER than even you so I don't even understand why do you use that as argument. And no matter how much u follow the issue, you are not going to know any better than someone who sees it first hand themselves by living there. Even if you follow everyyyy media outlet, every clue, everything you read on the internet, you will never ever ever in your life know how is it first hand if you won't live there yourself and gather yourself every fact. I'm not saying that you have to go there, of course not. My point is that you shouldn't rush to dismiss/invalidate someone elses opinion before reviewing it/thinking it very carefully and objectively. 

That being said, voicing your opinion on the subject is just that and that's how it needs to also remain. Just like everyone else here (let me remind you this is a music fan forum and not a politics/political in any way-forum) voice their opinions, of course as long it's in a respectful manner and not in a condescending-aggressive manner.

 

Hilarious indeed that once again you fail to see the point. Actually no the context in all my posts in response to that person and few people that followed after that, are exactly what I explained to you in my previous post. People upvoted my posts in agreement too because they understood the point of my post (unlike you). I explained to you very clearly what the reason was behind those posts but you refuse to see it because-again-you are simply biased/passionate/persistent on your views regarding Israel. You didn't do any favor. In fact the way you brought up only few particular posts (to your convenience) of mine accompanied with your own remarks only made me look worse. And you know what. If my post was leaning towards your own point of view on the israeli matter, you wouldn't be calling me an asshole now. Funny how that works To you: what is opposite of your view then = "asshole" ? Interesting.

 

 

We really need to agree that we are going to have same/or different views on the subject at hand here, and try to share our thoughts/learn as best as possible. Obviously there will be many different views, some correct,some wrong, some....50/50. In the end of the day from what it looks like, Lana is going to perform 100% in Israel. And there isn't anything to be done about it.

Why can't we just focus on that? If you people are interested too to share thoughts on the setlist etc? It's not like the concert won't happen. It will happen...

 

[Amadeus 11,334]

Israel shouldn't even exist. Palestine, no matter how problematic, is the rightful holder of that land.

 

so again: LONG LIVE PALESTINE.

 

so we should give the land back to the ottomans? 

[baddisease 17,953]

no i can elaborate further. this forums interests in political issues is as surface level as a marble counter so i'll leave it at that. 

if it bothers u so much then do something besides whining on the internet.

 

I dont even agree with Israel at all, i just dont feel a moderately popular artist should be the scapegoat for a music event that multiple artist are playing at, and that fans should call her war propaganda. get f-ing real.

 

Idk about anyone else, but I'm a highly political person IRL and I'm a member of political groups IRL.

 

I supported a similar protest when an orchestra was planning to play in Israel and for the IDF (which they then cancelled due to the protest).

 

Lana is an artist with a platform, much bigger than that orchestra, and none of those artists performing at that festival should be. Not while Israel is killing Palestinians.

 

She's not propaganda, but she is being deeply irresponsible.

so we should give the land back to the ottomans? 

 

The Ottomans were an imperial force occupying Palestine. Palestine should go back to its indigenous holders, the Palestinian people. The overwhelming majority of Israelis aren't indigenous to that land.

[LAman 3,224]

I find it funny how I'm being asked to educate others about the situation when I've referenced more relevant facts about the situation than most if not all the people commenting in this thread even though that hasn't been the focus of my posts and it's not my job to educate people.

I didn't see any credible references in your posts 

[missdelreyxo 3,786]

Idk about anyone else, but I'm a highly political person IRL and I'm a member of political groups IRL.

 

I supported a similar protest when an orchestra was planning to play in Israel and for the IDF (which they then cancelled due to the protest).

 

Lana is an artist with a platform, much bigger than that orchestra, and none of those artists performing at that festival should be. Not while Israel is killing Palestinians.

 

She's not propaganda, but she is being deeply irresponsible.

 

The Ottomans were an imperial force occupying Palestine. Palestine should go back to its indigenous holders, the Palestinian people. The overwhelming majority of Israelis aren't indigenous to that land.

I appreciate your mature and informative response and I understand it is deemed irresponsible. I think what was irresponsible of her to do was her three paragraph tweets that were vague and made her appear less intelligent then she actually is. She should make a new response that is cohesive and specific to why she wants to play there. My statement then does not apply to you.

[Amadeus 11,334]

The Ottomans were an imperial force occupying Palestine. Palestine should go back to its indigenous holders, the Palestinian people. The overwhelming majority of Israelis aren't indigenous to that land.

And Istanbul should be given back to the Greeks then considering the ottomans sieged it around the same time?

[baddisease 17,953]

And Istanbul should be given back to the Greeks then?

 

Are Greeks indigenous to Istanbul?

[evilentity 13,351]

Israel shouldn't even exist. Palestine, no matter how problematic, is the rightful holder of that land.

 

so again: LONG LIVE PALESTINE.

This goes too far for me. I believe Israel has a right to exist. But I believe Israel either needs to give Palestinians full autonomy and more territory or give them full citizenship in a greater state of Israel. And fundamentally, democracy is incompatible with being a permanent ethnostate or theocracy.

[baddisease 17,953]

This goes too far for me. I believe Israel has a right to exist. But I believe Israel either needs to give Palestinians full autonomy and more territory or give them full citizenship in a greater state of Israel. And fundamentally, democracy is incompatible with being a permanent ethnostate or theocracy.

 

I think there should be a single, federal, secular Palestinian state that gives equal rights to Palestinian and Israeli inhabitants. I don't agree with the two-state solution at all.

[evilentity 13,351]

I find it funny how I'm being asked to educate others about the situation when I've referenced more relevant facts about the situation than most if not all the people commenting in this thread even though that hasn't been the focus of my posts and it's not my job to educate people.

I didn't see any credible references in your posts 

I never said this was a high bar to clear, just that I clear it.

 

But I have made reference to occupation, Israel's disproportionate use of force, the current apartheid-like situation, land dispossession, the fact that Palestinians in the occupied territories have no representation in the Knesset, successes of previous BDS movements, etc.

[Flowerbomb 65,595]

I can't believe this thread is still going on lmao

[softcore babyface 4,377]

Lana really is digging herself into a hole huh? 

 

No matter if she cancels or goes she's going to cause controversy, if she says something against the israeli government at the show she's going to get a bad reaction. Also this article was posted https://electronicintifada.net/blogs/ali-abunimah/palestinians-say-no-lana-del-reys-token-gesture. I hope she just cancels at this point, her managers shouldn't have even booked this show in the first place. 

[kitschesque 9,884]

Are Greeks indigenous to Istanbul?

 

Babe Europe is completely different than the Native American situation. People were constantly migrating and re-claiming lands. It certainly wasn't in any case a simple invasion per se so to see the situation as "who claimed the land first" is a terrific simplification of history.

[theviolence 5,839]

its funny you're just sitting on your computer whining about something instead of directly contacting her since you're so devastated about it. You couldn't care less about palestine, ur fake wokeness is showing.

Who are you to determine where people's convictions really lie? You seem quick to label somebody as fake woke without offering any semblance of an argument to support your own views. All you are is a whiny stan like the rest of us. (and remind me how anybody is meant to directly contact Lana? The honeymoon hotline?)

[Valerie 1,379]

Are Greeks indigenous to Istanbul?

Constantinople (Istanbul) was originally Greek/belonged to Greece. Before the Ottomans conquered it.