Norman Fucking Rockwell - Post-Release Discussion Thread + Poll

[house of balloons 12,793]

please dont manifest this into a reality

 

so y'all gonna act as if Brite Lites isn't a whole ass bop 

[daphnedinkley 13,487]

I'm honestly not sure where the idea that anybody criticising the production, mixing and mastering of NFR wants Lana to make polished pop (a la BTD) comes from. 

 

Personally Ultraviolence is my favourite Lana album, so believe me when I say I love the raw, chaotic, grunge/rock/blues/jazz-hybrid sound that Lana's had before. NFR could potentially be my second favourite album, because I love what it has to offer: heartbreaking and complex lyricism (Hope), trippy surf-inspired guitars (MAC, Venice Bitch), an increased sense of instrumentation compared to LFL, and so on. All of these things add to the appeal of NFR.

 

However, what I (and I assume other people) have a problem with on NFR is that these elements (barring the lyricism which producers don't have any control over) are not taken full advantage of. I don't want these elements gone and replaced by hip-hop beats and BTD strings and synths; I (we?) want more of them. Take the chorus of MAC, one of my favourite songs, as an example: there's very little bass when the chorus kicks in, which squanders the almost anthemic feel of the track; the drums don't quite have a kick to them; on streaming services the chorus is quite scratchy and almost metallic-sounding when played at a loud volume (which is the only way to get any semblance of the rousing vibe the song intends to inspire), as if the volume of all the instruments and layers weren't balanced properly and everything is happening at the same volume, a sure-fire way to make the song sound a little messy when played loud.

 

Compare this to West Coast, for example: those drums HIT, the layering of the instruments is masterfully done, the chorus is hazy and fuzzy and trippy but not at the expense of the production value because it feels like you hear exactly what you're supposed to.

 

Look at How To Disappear - I like the song, but when the line "But I love that man like nobody can" kicks in, Lana's vocal track randomly jumps a lot louder on the track, probably to compensate for the bells being added so that they don't drown out Lana's voice. This, however, is incredibly jarring and definitely noticeable, and I assume a rather amateur way to go about balancing out vocals and instruments. In fact, a lot of people take issue with the bells on the song overall, but if they were done a little more tastefully instead of just being slapped on top of the instrumental then perhaps people wouldn't feel this way - I mean, everybody loves the guitar on Happiness is a Butterfly because it's subtle and artfully done. I'd also like to use Sad Girl as an example - the Spanish guitar that's added to the second verse isn't subtle but it's not exactly in-your-face either; it adds to the track without messing up the overall vibe and making the song messier than it has to be, it's perfectly blended, it sinks into the background that was already established but it's noticeable enough to considerably elevate the track and give you something to look forward to each time you listen.

 

It's these little production "errors" that I believe people have a problem with.

 

Cruel World is an example of a noisy, chaotic track that's beloved by the fanbase. Not everyone wants Lana to be some polished pop princess; they just want to feel as though her songs are treated with the care they deserve.

[love deluxe 8,861]

ALSO let me just say that each Lana album (to me, at least) has its strengths as well as its pitfalls. each album is important to me for different reasons and so i find it hard to rank them because i always THINK i know how i feel retrospectively. however, when i relisten to lust for life (the one i claim often is my least favorite), i find myself in love with it all over again. every song is great, (even coachella), and while i occasionally think it's a little messy in terms of cohesion, the songs still flow well together and DO feel like they belong on the same album. for me, the strengths of each albums are as follows:

 

 

born to die: innovative, a completely unique record for its time, aged incredibly well, plus the nostaliga factor. messy in cohesion, but it feels intentional.

paradise: writing became more developed, her sound from born to die was more refined, and felt more cohesive here. nostaliga, once again.

ultraviolence: its uncompromisingly lana lyric wise. however, i think the greatest strength of this album is that she did a complete switch on her sound and did an almost 100 percent rock album with few exceptions. she really didn't give a fuck during this era.

honeymoon: this album is one of her (objectively) stronger ones. lyrically, instrumentally, cohesively, etc. lana managed to check all the boxes and make a record that maintains a sound throughout but (to me) never feels particularly worn out. the blending of strings and hip hop is something that we saw on born to die, but on this record, lana managed to refine it to be 80% strings and 20% hip hop, so as to be more muted.

lust for life: this record is very timely. 2017 was a hellish time and this record really reflects that lyrically. the writing was a little messy, but to me it never felt unnecessary. the production was sleek and smooth, similar to born to die, but amping up the trap beats. i personally really love it, but understand why people don't.

norman fucking rockwell: her writing is arguably stronger than ever, as well as is her ability to make amazing melodies. this record is the one she's been trying to make since the beginning, i think. it's her most introspective, but shines some light on the world around her as well. production-wise, it does sound a little cheap. but to me, that harkens back to music from the 1970's a bit. anyone else who's heard ANY jack antonoff record knows how clean his production usually is (ie melodrama) so there's no reason to blame him for choices that lana most likely made as she's in creative control most of the time.

anyways yeah those are my personal strengths with each ldr record xx

[love deluxe 8,861]

so y'all gonna act as if Brite Lites isn't a whole ass bop

 

brite lites is NOT edm luv...

[Jared 3,131]

Jack's ability is so wild. It's beyond special. His musicianship is equal to my ability to find a beautiful melody. - Lana Del Rey

 

[Jared 3,131]

Without being cheesy, I asked:him (Jack): Am I allowed to have those chords? They were so beautiful. I just knew that if he was gonna let me have those chords, then I had literally just gotten so lucky. - Lana Del Rey

 

[CinnamonGay 10,527]

The Kiisfm interview has been uploaded..

 

She said NFR has a singer songwriter feel production wise and they CHOSE not to go crazy over the production.

 

It's such a beautiful record.... like I wouldnt change anything about the album tbh.

[DaddyATRL 3,878]

....

[Lanalouis1 2,511]

why does she bang on about Jack giving her those chords for Love song like it's some legendary incredible progression that's never been done before?

 

the chords in love song really aren't that special 

[CinnamonGay 10,527]

why does she bang on about Jack giving her those chords for Love song like it's some legendary incredible progression that's never been done before?

 

the chords in love song really aren't that special

 

I'm sorry but Love Song is really underrated at this forum. It's such an INTIMATE song..the feelings are so HONEST and it feels so RAW.

Such a special song for me. The chorus is mindblowingly SOFT yet so PURE.

 

Like it's so so so personal and the production is really serene and beautiful. Such a perfect melody. I love Jack for giving us Love Song.

[American Bottom 16,229]

Bartender is about Lana escaping from Win.

[West Coast 45,795]

I'm honestly not sure where the idea that anybody criticising the production, mixing and mastering of NFR wants Lana to make polished pop (a la BTD) comes from. 

 

Personally Ultraviolence is my favourite Lana album, so believe me when I say I love the raw, chaotic, grunge/rock/blues/jazz-hybrid sound that Lana's had before. NFR could potentially be my second favourite album, because I love what it has to offer: heartbreaking and complex lyricism (Hope), trippy surf-inspired guitars (MAC, Venice Bitch), an increased sense of instrumentation compared to LFL, and so on. All of these things add to the appeal of NFR.

 

However, what I (and I assume other people) have a problem with on NFR is that these elements (barring the lyricism which producers don't have any control over) are not taken full advantage of. I don't want these elements gone and replaced by hip-hop beats and BTD strings and synths; I (we?) want more of them. Take the chorus of MAC, one of my favourite songs, as an example: there's very little bass when the chorus kicks in, which squanders the almost anthemic feel of the track; the drums don't quite have a kick to them; on streaming services the chorus is quite scratchy and almost metallic-sounding when played at a loud volume (which is the only way to get any semblance of the rousing vibe the song intends to inspire), as if the volume of all the instruments and layers weren't balanced properly and everything is happening at the same volume, a sure-fire way to make the song sound a little messy when played loud.

 

Compare this to West Coast, for example: those drums HIT, the layering of the instruments is masterfully done, the chorus is hazy and fuzzy and trippy but not at the expense of the production value because it feels like you hear exactly what you're supposed to.

 

Look at How To Disappear - I like the song, but when the line "But I love that man like nobody can" kicks in, Lana's vocal track randomly jumps a lot louder on the track, probably to compensate for the bells being added so that they don't drown out Lana's voice. This, however, is incredibly jarring and definitely noticeable, and I assume a rather amateur way to go about balancing out vocals and instruments. In fact, a lot of people take issue with the bells on the song overall, but if they were done a little more tastefully instead of just being slapped on top of the instrumental then perhaps people wouldn't feel this way - I mean, everybody loves the guitar on Happiness is a Butterfly because it's subtle and artfully done. I'd also like to use Sad Girl as an example - the Spanish guitar that's added to the second verse isn't subtle but it's not exactly in-your-face either; it adds to the track without messing up the overall vibe and making the song messier than it has to be, it's perfectly blended, it sinks into the background that was already established but it's noticeable enough to considerably elevate the track and give you something to look forward to each time you listen.

 

It's these little production "errors" that I believe people have a problem with.

 

Cruel World is an example of a noisy, chaotic track that's beloved by the fanbase. Not everyone wants Lana to be some polished pop princess; they just want to feel as though her songs are treated with the care they deserve.

 

I couldn't have said it better myself.

[eahn89 0]

Not at all. Does your turntable play other records fine?

 

Yes! But I put a penny on the arm of the record player and it did not skip. I may just have to clean mine...

 

Thanks!

[Creyk 11,699]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oaIcLBwb1d4

 

Is this recent? I love how much she loves this song.

[Beautiful Loser 48,856]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oaIcLBwb1d4

 

Is this recent? I love how much she loves this song.

Her latest update on Instagram I think

[cherryblossoms 10,420]

LFL is full of fillers and questionable creative decisions but we needed a record like that to appreciate the greatness of NFR, yes we did

[cherryblossoms 10,420]

Well I said what I said. NFR is musically better than Lust for Life, but production wise, at least Lust for Life was somewhat consistent and had a clean sound. NFR on the other hand is all over the place with its cheap microphone, sketchy mixing and lack of bass.

 

She literally sang through a sheet of paper on certain LFL songs for “artistic effect.” Including a song that had Stevie Nicks as a feature

I feel like that alone trumps any shortcomings from this era like what even was that

[Make me your Dream Life 87,876]

itturnsoutcaliforniasmorethanjustastateofmindimetuontheboulevardwindinmyhairublewmymindndifiwasntsofuckeduPithinki'dfuckuallthetime it'skillingmeslowllly CALIFORNIA DREAM I GOT MUNNY ON MY MIND CHANCES IN MY VEINS RUNNIN OUTTA TIME CALIFORNIA DREAMIN MUNNY ON MY MIND *alien outro*

[West Coast 45,795]

She literally sang through a sheet of paper on certain LFL songs for “artistic effect.” Including a song that had Stevie Nicks as a feature

I feel like that alone trumps any shortcomings from this era like what even was that

 

That's true, but somehow singing through that sheet of paper sounded better than some of the recordings on NFR. 

LFL is full of fillers and questionable creative decisions but we needed a record like that to appreciate the greatness of NFR, yes we did

Agree, that album was half filler tracks and very questionable artistic decisions, but I can honestly say the same about NFR. 

I don't mean to stir the pot, but that's how I feel.

[cherryblossoms 10,420]

That's true, but somehow singing through that sheet of paper sounded better than some of the recordings on NFR.

 

Agree, that album was half filler tracks and very questionable artistic decisions, but I can honestly say the same about NFR.

I don't mean to stir the pot, but that's how I feel.

But I’m on the same page about the mixing to be honest. I wish the sound was a bit fuller on NFR and not so hollow on some tracks but it is what it is. Though I feel like the mixing actually works with the musicality of the record this time around though compared to LFL.. LFL has a very muddy sound that doesn’t do much for the sleekness of some tracks. Love being one of the worst offenders. It would’ve been cool if it had a really futuristic, clean sound but Lana really can’t ditch that lo-fi mixing