Norman Fucking Rockwell - Post-Release Discussion Thread + Poll

[lustforlife 19,008]

Lana, Jack and a police man

 

[PARADIXO 32,943]

I will admit, I would like to be in a fandom where an artist wins for once. However, I don't live my life liking things based on what awards they get, so I'm not too fussed! It would have been a deserving win, but on reflection here are some factors I think of why NFR didn't:

• Little to no campaigning from Lana to actually win the award. No interviews, long stretches on social media with no content related to the album, no TV performances or high profile talk shows to build and maintain hype. Is this her management or her? I'm inclined to think her.
• Shambolic roll-out of the album, including confusion over the singles. Venice Bitch and MAC weren't even confirmed inclusions until the track list came out, and at the time were called something dumb like 'fan singles'? The slow roll out of some of her strongest and well-received pieces (Venice Bitch, MAC and even Hope) meant they almost entirely dropped out of public view, and lead to an ineligibility of those tracks leads to none of them being able to nominated for Song of the Year. Norman Fucking Rockwell simply didn't have the same appeal. Also releasing the 
• Norman Fucking Rockwell was never, ever, EVER going to win song of the year. It didn't even have a film clip until very late last year. It wasn't sent to radio stations, and wasn't radio friendly. 
• She never sung her singles at her concerts. She balks at performing new material, and has fucked up with shaky performances live more than once. She didn't even perform at the awards. This is basically cementing the perception that she is still living in 'Born to Die' territory. Again, this is self-sabotage. 
• The title of the album, and the singles ('Venice Bitch', 'Norman FUCKING!! Rockwell', 'Fuck It I Love You') put prudes off, affected YouTube algorithms and search results on Google, and would have diluted aggregated results for the album due to the different titles (Norman Fucking Rockwell OR NFR! or Norman F**king Rockwell OR Norman Rockwell OR whatever else). The album didn't have the same appeal as things that regularly popped up like Bad Guy. The sacrifice of this title didn't really resonate with a lot of people and an artistic choice that probably put people off.
• The awards are rigged (discussed as recently as this week from the President of the Grammys), and most likely a committee was wanting to pick something popular to stay 'in touch' with current trends.
• It's still not 'cool' to like Lana del Rey. 
• Obviously she would be proud of the music, but apparently she can't even produce nice artwork for her singles, or format the titles of her tracks correctly. That really projects a feeling like she couldn't care less. If she doesn't care, why bother giving it to her? 
• Maybe controversially, it's simply not as good as her previous albums (?) and didn't have as many hits.

While I wish she'd won, I think if she DID win, it would undeservingly absolve a lot of these issues that we were unhappy with during the roll-out of the album. If she is truly driven, and keen on winning the Grammy, then for the next album hopefully she will trust her managers a touch more, and we will see a refreshed approach, with a more considered approach to promotion and sensible choices. But maybe she actually doesn't care! (we know she does but eh). 

 

I loved your post. The only point I didn't agree with was the second to last one (and obviously the very last one) -- The song titles are in sentence style (as you most likely already know)... and Billie's album's first track is literally titled "!!!!!!" and they're all in lower case, so I don't think it really matters.

[Rorman Nockwell 56,734]

[REDACTED]

 

Trumatic

 

[West Coast 45,795]

I loved your post. The only point I didn't agree with was the second to last one (and obviously the very last one) -- The song titles are in sentence style (as you most likely already know)... and Billie's album's first track is literally titled "!!!!!!" and they're all in lower case, so I don't think it really matters.

 

Nah, his whole summary is very, very accurate, but especially the last two points. I feel like something that people seem to have missed about the whole Grammy debacle is that often times so called "critical acclaim" doesn't necessarily translate to guaranteed victory. 

[kingadam 761]

https://www.instagram.com/p/B7zlEelALMU/?utm_source=ig_embed&utm_campaign=embed_video_watch_again

 

anyone knows what song they used for this?

[West Coast 45,795]

[REDACTED]

 

[13bitches 6,176]

[REDACTED]

[PARADIXO 32,943]

Nah, his whole summary is very, very accurate, but especially the last two points. I feel like something that people seem to have missed about the whole Grammy debacle is that often times so called "critical acclaim" doesn't necessarily translate to guaranteed victory.

 

That is not what I meant though. The other user said the songs aren’t taken seriously because they aren’t “properly” titled

[West Coast 45,795]

That is not what I meant though. The other user said the songs aren’t taken seriously because they aren’t “properly” titled

 

Well, that's exactly what I meant. The random capitalization of the song titles is weird and very random to me. Also, the singles' artwork were really bad (she legit took a selfie for Hope and that was it). Furthermore, I venture to say that a lot of people have mixed feelings about the album's artwork. To me it's a pretty picture, but the execution is muted and amateur (much like the content of the album itself). Finally, why bother naming your album 'Norman Fucking Rockwell!' when you never even refer to the album with its actual title, which very much includes, literally, all the released physical copies of the album.

[maxthehitman 1,729]

posted by Takeitdoen

Posted 27 January 2020 - 08:28 AM

 

I will admit, I would like to be in a fandom where an artist wins for once. However, I don't live my life liking things based on what awards they get, so I'm not too fussed! It would have been a deserving win,

but on reflection here are some factors I think of why NFR didn't:

 MAX -  Don´t worry, you are not alone. I also like many bands and singers which never got any awards, but they surely deserve them.

 

- Little to no campaigning from Lana to actually win the award. No interviews, long stretches on social media with no content related to the album, no TV performances or high profile talk shows to

build and maintain hype. Is this her management or her? I'm inclined to think her.

MAX - I actually think its the management fault. I never trust big business. They have lots of MONEY to promote a record, and in this case, they did not promote it so well.

 

- Shambolic roll-out of the album, including confusion over the singles. Venice Bitch and MAC weren't even confirmed inclusions until the track list came out, and at the time were called something

dumb like 'fan singles'? The slow roll out of some of her strongest and well-received pieces (Venice Bitch, MAC and even Hope) meant they almost entirely dropped out of public view,

and lead to an ineligibility of those tracks leads to none of them being able to nominated for Song of the Year. Norman Fucking Rockwell simply didn't have the same appeal. 

MAX - I agree. Things should have been thought out properly before releasing the entire package to the public.

 

- Norman Fucking Rockwell was never, ever, EVER going to win song of the year. It didn't even have a film clip until very late last year. It wasn't sent to radio stations, and wasn't radio friendly. 

MAX - I also agree. Perhaps this was not meant to be. It may be more of a "side-project" for Lana , or as they say "An Art Album", which many musicians have put out in the past.

 

- She never sung her singles at her concerts. She balks at performing new material, and has fucked up with shaky performances live more than once. She didn't even perform at the awards.

This is basically cementing the perception that she is still living in 'Born to Die' territory. Again, this is self-sabotage. 

MAX - "Self Sabotage", it does sounds like it, but I would wait a little more before I spank her butt. Perhaps she is passing through a down-phase in her life and needs some "L - O - V - E" once

again to make her life feel complete.

 

- The title of the album, and the singles ('Venice Bitch', 'Norman FUCKING!! Rockwell', 'Fuck It I Love You') put prudes off, affected YouTube algorithms and search results on Google, and would have diluted

aggregated results for the album due to the different titles (Norman Fucking Rockwell OR NFR! or Norman F**king Rockwell OR Norman Rockwell OR whatever else). The album didn't have the same appeal

as things that regularly popped up like Bad Guy. The sacrifice of this title didn't really resonate with a lot of people and an artistic choice that probably put people off.

MAX - This I totally agree. Even tho I like the profane Title words used, I would consider a diferent word, because of the Internet searchs AND the "moral" of some Americans.

Here in Europe we are used to seeing everything (profanity, girls taking showers in commercials, and nudist beaches - to Europeans it is all normal life style and nothing to be shocked about, BUT

in America, most of these things are still considered "Tabboo", they are a No No.

You cannot even say the word "FUCK" on the U.S. Television, but you sure can buy a machine-gun at your local Wallmart store.   

 

- The awards are rigged (discussed as recently as this week from the President of the Grammys), and most likely a committee was wanting to pick something popular to stay 'in touch' with current trends.

MAX - VERY TRUE ! It was no secret. The same things happens with the Oscar awards.

 

- It's still not 'cool' to like Lana del Rey. 

MAX - Unfortunately this is also true for a large part of the American population... But everywhere else she goes to out of the U.S. she is a major STAR. She really

needs to start doing more overseas concerts in Central and South America, Europe and Asia !!  The U.S. market is already sold on too much Hip-Hop artists and one-hit single artists.

But so what?   -> It´s still "not cool" to listen to Bjork, Alanis Morissette, Adele, Cher, Barbara Streisand, Celine Dion etc. etc., and they are some of the best singers we

have the pleasure to listen to in our lifetime.

 

- Obviously she would be proud of the music, but apparently she can't even produce nice artwork for her singles, or format the titles of her tracks correctly. That really projects a feeling like she

couldn't care less. If she doesn't care, why bother giving it to her? 

MAX - Maybe she does not know about "Lanaboards.com" ? An important rule of a musician who wants to continue in the business is to TALK to their FANS.

To Listen to their ideas and opinions. She does NOT HAVE to do exactly what we want, but take things into consideration, AND there are many fans here who could

give her ideas for a better looking record cover for her singles and albums. 

 

- Maybe controversially, it's simply not as good as her previous albums (?) and didn't have as many hits.

MAX - Personally, I like them all. A person has to take into mind that NOT ALL records are perfect, but rather have some cool music to keep a person feeling good about themselves and

the world around them... unless you have a John Lennon + Paul McCartney in your band. Then all sorts of magic would be happening in the studio !

 

While I wish she'd won, I think if she DID win, it would undeservingly absolve a lot of these issues that we were unhappy with during the roll-out of the album. If she is truly driven, and keen

on winning the Grammy, then for the next album hopefully she will trust her managers a touch more, and we will see a refreshed approach, with a more considered approach to promotion

and sensible choices. But maybe she actually doesn't care! (we know she does but eh). 

MAX - Don´t worry too much about it.

An award is only good to gather dust on the shelf. What matters is that she continues doing what she does because she ENJOYS IT.

Once the "joy of making music" ends, then its time for Lana Del Rey to retire and become once again Elizabeth Grant.     I still miss Alanis Morissette and her songwriting genious.

She chose to be a full time mom, I understand that, but I will cherish all of her cool music and lyrics.

 

 

[takeitdoen 10,627]

I could have articulated the last two points, but to elaborate:

• The song titles whatever, they're yuck for me but probably inconsequential in the grand scheme. But the artwork and the roll-out of the singles and 'fan' singles were really nonchalant. It did have the vibe of 'whatever I don't care' and I do believe if you're very blasé about these sorts of things, it's really hard to expect others to also have respect. It ties back in with self-promoting, but telling everyone that the album isn't a big deal and then expecting it to be a big deal is counter-intuitive. 
• The question of it not being as good is of course subjective, but undeniably there are less radio-friendly singles on this album. We know this based on individual song placements, which are virtually nothing, and certainly not #1 material (songs, NOT album). Her management seems to not have promoted the works appropriately and the tracks are either too long, have obscene titles, or are just not poppy hits (which is what the Grammys are all about). Therefore I think it's reasonable to say it didn't have as many 'hits'. 

 

The other user

omg do people not know my name I try so hard   lel

[maxthehitman 1,729]

To be honest, RADIO stations these days only play music which they get paid big money from the music industry to "play their records" ,

OR

the songs are already too old and the radios don´t have to pay as much royalties everytime they play them on-air. 

 

I listen to about 5 to 7 radio stations everyday while I am working (Yeah, I really like music) but what I hear on the radios is a mix of ALOT of dance and Hip-Hop tunes ,

alot of one-hit wonders or the constant re-plays of old songs.

It is very annoying      because none of my favorite singers or bands are ever played. So when I get the chance, I turn off the radio and I play a CD !

I Don´t hear anything on my radio stations from Lana Del Rey, or U2, or any of the bands I like ! NEVER ! It´s so sad.

At least when I play a CD, I dont have to listen to those stupid commercials either.  

[Make me your Dream Life 87,884]

 

I wasn't ready for this

[SparkleJumpropeNoose 8,750]

I wasn't ready for this

none of us were

[Dark Angel 202,381]

 

why does his burger look like it's made out of foam

[maxthehitman 1,729]

why does his burger look like it's made out of foam

 

 

I think its one of those "Veggies Burgers" or something made of cardboard

[Doll Harlow 12,367]

 

@Jared

[CmonDownToFL 6,680]

Sheets so wet that they turn brown....

Buns reflecting in your eyes, with a greasy burger

 

[Barry 5,935]

Lana deserved to win it for the people, just think of everyone out there who haven't really noticed or heard her songs yet that would become big fans if they got the chance like from the back of publicity about her winning album of the year. Billie Eilish's streams on spotify have doubled since she won the awards, its what Lana deserved

[Vertimus 9,558]

I think the Billie Eilish album has the creative unpredictability, carefree attitude and fun of LDR’s early work, and the production is pristine. ‘I Love You’ is better than everything on NFR, which I still find largely, but not completely, redundant, clunky and flaccid. Billie deserved to win.