Galilee, Israel @ Meteor Festival - Sep 7, 2018 (CANCELLED)

[Peachycream 3,647]

I just hope the Israelis come through with HD concert footage

[LAman 3,223]

I never said this was a high bar to clear, just that I clear it.

 

But I have made reference to occupation, the current apartheid-like situation, land dispossession, the fact that Palestinians in the occupied territories have no representation in the Knesset, successes of previous BDS movements, etc.

I just think it's dangerous to reference something this serious without credible evidence. Kitschesque attempted to do so, so you're still below the bar.

[Flowerbomb 65,592]

Tbh I can understand both sides of the argument regarding this situation, but Lana has clearly made her decision. So if any of you don't like it, try talking to her (since she's feeling generous about tweeting with fans). Other than that, there's not much that can be done about this performance.

[theviolence 5,837]

I just think it's dangerous to reference something this serious without credible evidence. Kitschesque attempted to do so, so you're still below the bar.

I mean, all of this has been documented for decades. Short of posting an entire essay complete with Harvard referencing to Lanaboards, it would probably be more productive to research around the claims you doubt to form your own conclusions

[baddisease 17,652]

Babe Europe is completely different than the Native American situation. People were constantly migrating and re-claiming lands. It certainly wasn't in any case a simple invasion per se so to see the situation as "who claimed the land first" is a terrific simplification of history.

 

Well, Palestine isn't Europe. And Palestine is close to the Native American situation. Palestinian people lived on and took care of that land and were forced more and more to cede land to "Israel", which only exists because the West wanted it to exist (and now has the nukes to secure its existence).

[AKASAKA SAWAYAMA 7,882]

bitches ottoman is fucking dead. stop mentioning it

[evilentity 13,341]

I wrote a long response to Lana's first shitty explanation on Twitter a couple days ago which I'll post when I get around to screenshotting it

As promised:

 

 

 

 

 

And here's why her follow-up explanation on Instagram is also garbage. The middle paragraph, on its own, would have been about as good an explanation as possible (note the qualification) to give if followed up by concrete action, which is also a big if. But the opening "My views on democracy and oppression are aligned with most liberal views" is just meaningless. It doesn't say what she really thinks about anything and ignores the fact that many so-called "liberals" support the occupation of Palestine or have other hawkish views. The final sentence is contradictory bullshit. The action she is taking means she doesn't really understand what Roger Waters is saying at all.

[Amadeus 11,333]

Well, Palestine isn't Europe. And Palestine is close to the Native American situation. Palestinian people lived on and took care of that land and were forced more and more to cede land to "Israel", which only exists because the West wanted it to exist (and now has the nukes to secure its existence).

Historically the regions of the middle east, mediterranean africa and europe are linked together, which is probably what Kitschesque was referring to.

 

And the historical Palestinians (which weren't the "indigenous population" to begin with) are mostly not the same people who are calling themselves palestinians now anyway.

[clementines 9,868]

i dont know if now is the best or worst time to do coachella live

[LAman 3,223]

I mean, all of this has been documented for decades. Short of posting an entire essay complete with Harvard referencing to Lanaboards, it would probably be more productive to research around the claims you doubt to form your own conclusions

Yes I agree, but the minute people start throwing words like genocide and ethnic cleansing then that is what I see as dangerous and manipulative towards unaware people. I have been doing my own research, but I doubt outsiders like me who have a strong opinion about this as if they have the experience and solution. I just wanted to make that point. 

[kitschesque 9,881]

Well, Palestine isn't Europe.

 

True, what I meant by Europe was this big chunk of land that's Eurasia in general, my bad!

[missdelreyxo 3,786]

Who are you to determine where people's convictions really lie? You seem quick to label somebody as fake woke without offering any semblance of an argument to support your own views. All you are is a whiny stan like the rest of us. (and remind me how anybody is meant to directly contact Lana? The honeymoon hotline?)

Evilentity is a site moderator and can easily get in touch with Ben and her management to send her a message, Ben himself frequents this site on a monthly basis. I have every right to share my opinion about others intentions just like you. This is a forum. Deal with it. Pertaining to my statement addressing certain members as "fake woke", it appears to me a few, not all are conveniently riveted about the matter without any specific attachment to either parties involved, which leads me to believe their motives lie far from genuine concern and compassion. Member @@baddisease explained their perspective and i find their interests genuine. While others have not specified their sudden jurisdiction against her.  

[theviolence 5,837]

It doesn't let me quote so @belissimamorte

 

Who said you had no right to share opinions...? Who said you have to have a direct connection to any particular issue in order to have an interest in it? Why do you think site moderators have some nuanced connection to Lana's management? Everybody has a stake in this conflict because it is an egregious violation of international law and human rights.

[cashcomesquick 5,381]

God bless Palestine and all the beautiful innocent people in it ❤️

[missdelreyxo 3,786]

It doesn't let me quote so @belissimamorte

Who said you had no right to share opinions...? Who said you have to have a direct connection to any particular issue in order to have an interest in it? Why do you think site moderators have some nuanced connection to Lana's management? Everybody has a stake in this conflict because it is an egregious violation of international law and human rights.

 

Because they do have contact with her management. Lana has no impact in whether or not anything will change between the two so it is a lose lose situation. Shes playing a music festival not going on a pro israel f palestine lives israel is skinny campaign. You’re so quick to shut it down without viewing all perspectives. Shes gonna play it regardless shes made that clear. So you will either accept it or not. Whining will not make progress in any direction.

[Auto-Tuned Loon 650]

Evilentity is a site moderator and can easily get in touch with Ben and her management to send her a message, Ben himself frequents this site on a monthly basis.

This is hilarious in ways I can't explain.

 

But while I'm here, as an incarcerated bird I express my solidarity with living beings in cages of all kinds, be they separated children in ICE detention facilities, Palestinians behind the West Bank barrier or the blockade of the Gaza Strip by land, sea, and air(!), or a loon in Emile Haynie's basement goddamnit someone let me out!

[Wynwood 19,967]

on one hand i love that lanas being controversial but on the other i think she's trying too hard to be this john lennon world peace hippie

[missdelreyxo 3,786]

This is hilarious in ways I can't explain.

 

But while I'm here, as an incarcerated bird I express my solidarity with living beings in cages of all kinds, be they separated children in ICE detention facilities, Palestinians behind the West Bank barrier or the blockade of the Gaza Strip by land, sea, and air(!), or a loon in Emile Haynie's basement goddamnit someone let me out!

i thought emile roasted you in his brick oven last thanksgiving, good to have u back

[slang 1,532]

 

I think there should be a single, federal, secular Palestinian state that gives equal rights to Palestinian and Israeli inhabitants. I don't agree with the two-state solution at all.

 

 

I recommend Wikipedia:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1948_Palestinian_exodus

for general information. Seems pretty fair and balance, and there are links to other such articles.

 

A one-state solution would seem required for providing Israel security. An autonomous Palestine always carries with it the (high) probability of Arab-alliances providing offensive weapons to Palestine to harm Israel (leading Israel to just re-conquer the region and no progress being made). Historically, this has happened in the recent past as when the Gaza strip was weaponized in 2014 via rocket launchers. If anybody is going to take a leadership role in a one-state solution (now), it's going to have to be the Israelis. They are the de facto power in the region and are skilled in making their own people prosperous (yeah, they really did that). I am an Israeli sympathizer, even though I dislike what Israel, as well as Arab countries, are doing/have done to sustain the conflict. Had the Israelis used the soon-to-be-expelled Palestinian population as a bargaining chip in 1948 (promising to integrate them in a constitutionally protected, democratic society, protecting freedom of religion and other human rights) AND had the whole Arab world, or even a significant part of it, seriously entertained the idea of Israel existing, we could have had a viable single-state solution from the get go. Don't think it would have been called Israel, but maybe IPPI.

 

For balance, here are some interesting artists on LDR's side with respect to playing Israel.

https://www.spin.com/2017/07/thom-yorke-radiohead-israel-concert-statement/

https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/music/news/nick-cave-isreal-show-palestine-boycott-aparthied-bds-roger-waters-thom-yorke-latest-a8065366.html

https://www.haaretz.com/world-news/europe/morrissey-s-new-album-those-who-insult-israel-are-jealous-1.5464774

[evilentity 13,341]

Yes I agree, but the minute people start throwing words like genocide and ethnic cleansing then that is what I see as dangerous and manipulative towards unaware people. I have been doing my own research, but I doubt outsiders like me who have a strong opinion about this as if they have the experience and solution. I just wanted to make that point.

I have not used those words. I think disproportionate violence to perpetuate an apartheid-like state is enough on which to make the case for BDS without getting into whether those other terms apply. I just wanted to make that point.

 

Evilentity is a site moderator and can easily get in touch with Ben and her management to send her a message, Ben himself frequents this site on a monthly basis.

Why do you think site moderators have some nuanced connection to Lana's management?

Because they do have contact with her management.

I don't think people really appreciate the frankly adversarial nature, when not distant, of the relationship Lana's management has historically had to the forum. Both the past and current administrator have had interactions with management, and I suspect Elle's relationship with them is warmer than Tiarnan's was, but I'm not aware of any moderators interacting with them. I have never had any contact with them anyway. If Ben is aware of me he probably hates me. I've frequently been critical of him. The truth is her management is extremely aggressive and has often made threats against the forum over ridiculous things. Behind the scenes I have consistently advocated against self-censorship or kowtowing to threats without a solid legal basis.

 

Pertaining to my statement addressing certain members as "fake woke", it appears to me a few, not all are conveniently riveted about the matter without any specific attachment to either parties involved, which leads me to believe their motives lie far from genuine concern and compassion. Member @@baddisease explained their perspective and i find their interests genuine. While others have not specified their sudden jurisdiction against her.

@ me next time

 

Where do you get off presuming to judge the sincerity of people's motives without basis? Especially people you know fuck-all about.

 

FYI I've been very pro-Palestinian since I read Chomsky in 2005 if not before that. I legit confronted my congressman at a town hall years ago for having too pro-Israel a stance on his website. Believe it or not, I first learned that Lana was playing this show not from LanaBoards or any other Lana-related site, but from my mostly political completely non-Lana Twitter account under my real name because Glenn Greenwald retweeted a PACBI tweet about it into my feed. I'm not going to, but I could show you conversations I've had with other Lana fans evincing my pro-Palestinian views going back 6 years. I don't recall there previously being an occasion that demanded discussion of Israel/Palestine specifically, but my stance is quite obviously consistent with my record of policing Islamophobic comments. As far as my "sudden jurisdiction against her", anybody who knows a thing about me knows I've never been shy about criticizing Lana and it's not the first time I've criticized her politics or lack thereof. So it's not like I'm some posturing bandwagoner here or whatever you're trying to insinuate. I have genuine long-running convictions about this issue and her playing this festival genuinely bothers me.

 

I find it bizarre (and depressing) that a number of people in this thread seem to have a hard time wrapping their heads around the idea that someone might empathize with other people they have no "specific attachment to" aside from their shared humanity. Or if they did that they wouldn't if they didn't.

 

Who said you have to have a direct connection to any particular issue in order to have an interest in it? ... Everybody has a stake in this conflict because it is an egregious violation of international law and human rights.

Well said.

 

Shes gonna play it regardless shes made that clear. So you will either accept it or not. Whining will not make progress in any direction.

I do not accept it. I don't know if protesting will move her, but I feel compelled to try.

 

I recommend Wikipedia:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1948_Palestinian_exodus

for general information. Seems pretty fair and balance, and there are links to other such articles.

That's good historical background. I'd also recommend this section of this entry for more recent context:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_rights_in_Israel#Human_rights_in_the_occupied_territories